Posted by Lion Buying NPC A.K.A. Fixing Lioden's Economy!
Taxxi (#37009)

King of the Jungle
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Posted on
2014-12-22 06:00:24
Hey citizens of Lioden, Taxxi here. It's my first time posting anything in this board, and while everything in my idea may look solid to me, it always helps to have a little bit of constructive criticism and/or suggestions! So if you read this and don't support it, feel free to explain why you don't, or offer a suggestion that might change your mind! :]
I've also done a little searching and I haven't found anything similar to this, so either it's been shot down in the past, hasn't been proposed, or I haven't seen it. Either way please be kind, I'm just trying to help solve a big problem here.

There's a lot of blabbling between here and the main point, so if you want to get to just the bulletpoints, skip down to the big bolded summary.

Anyway, a lot of people, myself included, have been frustrated by the economy of Lioden. Examining it, it seems like we have a couple of problems here: 1) A shortage of SB in the economy, 2) a surplus of unwanted or unsellable cubs, and, although not tackled in this solution, but obviously a contender to the problem, 3) high stud fees.
EDIT: Apparently there is not a shortage of SB (this may not be the problem as I suspected) - so why are nice lions going for dirt cheap/or are unsellable?

If you're like me, the inability to sell quality cubs for a decent price, i.e. over 100sb, has severely harmed your experience with Lioden. I love this game, and I want to continue loving this game, but this makes it hard!

So, Zephyr and i tossed around some ideas, and we came up with a tentative solution that goes a little something like this:

- An npc, like the Monkey, who - instead of buying items from you - buys unwanted lions in a range of 100-300sb.

BUT WAIT, you say, won't someone exploit this?
Of course people will want to exploit this, so we thought about thwarting that.

- Each lion could be priced depending on markings OR stats OR both, so that a lion with one marking and low stats (an NCL, for example) would only fetch 100sb, whereas a lion that has been bred several generations in, with say seven markings and 200 stats, may fetch something along the lines of 200sb. How detailed staff would want to get into this is up to them, but the option to have custom markings worth more money is always an option.

My line of thinking was to have the NPC pay in line with Decor's pricing guide, although slightly less, which would encourage sales and actual purchase of lion cubs by PLAYERS. This would encourage people to first attempt to sell to people first, but if they for whatever reason cannot, then they aren't totally out of the stud fees that they've paid.

Now let me briefly bring up stud fees, because although this solution does not tackle them (there isn't an inherent problem with stud fee prices in my opinion), it is affected by them.

Say you find a nice, cheap stud. Lots of markings, really beautiful lion. Stud fee is 500sb. Now that's pretty cheap, since a lot of really, really nice lions can go for 1000sb, or even in the GB range. Now say you stud a nice lady to him, and she, best case scenario, has four really, REALLY nice cubs. In the current Lioden economy, you really only get around 75sb for a cub on a good day. Assuming you sell ALL of these nice cubs and keep NONE for yourself, you're only going to make 400sb, that's a 100sb deficit from your original stud fee. Not including any food that you fed these lions to keep them happy or whatever.

Obviously this is frustrating. It's frustrated me for months, and in recent times, has frustrated me even more. Sure, there's ugly cubs, this is a fact of life. But there are really, really nice ones that someone could use, and either they're sold for way below value, or chased, and that's sad.

And, not to throw Decor under the bus or anything here, but located at the very top of the pricing guide is a quote:
"For myself I would like to get at least some back on the studfee if the cub Im selling dont turn out the way I wanted/need it to be (if Im aiming for something special) but the cub isnt "ugly" (or "plain") enough to not at least deserve a chance for a new home. So...I put together these little pricing "guides", in parts building on both stats, basecolor and markings."


SUMMARY

-- An NPC that would buy lions from people (effectively chasing them, but for money and without the guilt)
-- Prices would range from 100-300sb based on stats/# of markings.
-- Prices would be LOWER than Decor's Pricing Guide to encourage people to use this as a baseline for player-to-player lion sales
(for example, a lion sold by Decor's guide might sell to a PLAYER for 250sb, but the NPC would only offer 150sb, etc.)
-- This would lower the amount of unwanted lions floating around Lioden
BUT
-- It would also feed SB into the economy, which means that nice lions would actually sell for what they're worth
-- The system could either not accept NCLs (to prevent blatant exploitation), or pay dirt for them.
-- We could also instill a daily/weekly/monthly limit to discourage 'farming' of lions just to get money. The goal here is to make lions sold to PLAYERS worth more than lions sold to NPC, while still providing sb to the economy to promote this exchange.

-- I understand Lioden is run off of purchasing GB/donations/actual real life money, so the SB value of GB would inherently go up, with all of the sb floating around in the economy. This might even help promote actual real life money spending for GB via the Oasis, instead of SB. However it would not be impossible for people who cannot afford to by GB with real life money to purchase GB via sb.

Obviously the idea is still in a working stage, and if you have suggestions to better it, just let me know!



This suggestion has 41 supports and 1 NO support.



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Edited on 22/12/14 by Taxxi (#37009)

HATI {I LUV CAPS} (#43252)

Kind
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Posted on
2014-12-22 06:11:21
support :3



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Zephyr (#36891)

Impeccable
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Posted on
2014-12-22 06:12:52
Woo! :D



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Toska (#19637)

Deathlord of the Jungle
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Posted on
2014-12-22 06:15:31
Its nice you want to try and help the economy. But I think you made some points in you or post that I don't agree with.

1) SB shortage. SB is constantly flowing into the game. I have 10k at any given moment. A lot of people want to "cap" SB. This has been done in exploring, but if anything, only more SB is coming into the game.

2) high priced studs. People can offer their king for studding however they want. But who you stud is entirely your choice. I have made 4 GB off a 175 SB stud. I was smart with my lionesses and who I chose to stud, and I got cubs that people were looking for. Granted, everyone gets those floppy batches of cubs, but nothing stops you from trying again and making up for the deficit.

Also, you said the prices would be lower then Decor's pricing guide. Her guide isn't official, its just her and many other's opinion. If Lioden was to do what you say, and buy lionesses cheaper then Decor's, then they would be putting a specific value on lionesses. I doubt the admins would want to do that, it's the same reason the GB to SB converter in Oasis is still 150 SB. They don't want to set a specific price on anything. People can sell what they want for whatever they want.



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naturalharmony (#9987)

Good Natured
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Posted on
2014-12-22 06:16:15
Sorry, no support. :T

I know you acknowledged that it could be exploited but honestly, people could just keep on mass-breeding NCLs to their lions, sell the cubs to the NPC and soon they're rich because there's no loss (if you're using NCLs and your own lion, there's no payment involved).

There would probably be other ways that users would exploit it that I can't think of right now. Also, it would probably do the opposite of its intention and devalue SB because you get so much of it so easily.



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Attacked By
Vampires🦇⚰ (#39236)

King of the Jungle
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Posted on
2014-12-22 06:21:23
Actually there's too much sb as Mungu said, and not a shortage. And Natural has some valid arguments. For the moment no support. However perhaps the NPC idea has potential though I believe it may have been suggested before c:



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Taxxi (#37009)

King of the Jungle
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Posted on
2014-12-22 06:34:09
Thanks so much for your input guys!

So there's too much SB, something I was unaware of. Alright, alright.

Why aren't people buying lions for fair prices, then? I mean obviously yes, it's the player's choice of who they stud to, and how much they're willing to pay for those studs. Like I said, I don't think stud fees themselves are inherently the problem at all, but rather how much the cubs go for thereafter.

There's quite a bit of thought put into breeding lions, with their markings and things such as that, but there's always flops. Some of those flops are very bad, and should be chased. Others aren't, and could be used by other people. But there's no way to make up for stud fee prices if lions are going for 20sb a piece. Obviously not everyone has this problem, but I've noticed a fair amount of it going around. Hence this post of course :] Also, some people's studs aren't as good as others, which is fair enough, and they can't garner as much income from their own studs as other people might.

As for exploitation - people are always going to try to exploit things, which is why I've included a couple of workarounds to that in the original post, such as the daily/weekly/monthly limit. Prices I suppose could be even lower, for plainer lions, lower-statted lions. And farming wouldn't be made a huge issue if there was a limit. Although if you think there are other facets I haven't looked at, or better solutions to these, lemme know!

As far as putting a price on lions, yes that's something I didn't think of. I'm not sure if that's why the price is still so low in the Oasis though? I mean correct me if I'm wrong. As far as putting a price on the lions goes, it's a concern I'm sure, but this is kind of crazy don't you think? Obviously economies fluctuate, and obviously the prices of the NPC could be upped/downed accordingly? Or perhaps the baseline for the NPC's prices could start closer to 100? And perhaps exceptional lions could be ranked higher? The logistics of the pricings themselves of course can be changed, hence why I asked for the input!

Thanks guys! :]



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Axel (#6627)

Pervert
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Posted on
2014-12-22 06:50:36
I am afraid I cannot support this.

My reasons:

1. Shortage of SB? There is a lot of SB in the system, the fact that the skip feature was abused is the best example. Getting SB is very easy. All you need to do: Play the game. Dont just breed but explore and hunt a lot too and you will get SB. More than what you can spend.

2. 100-200SB/lion? You do know that this feature would be greatly abused by the mass-breeders? These people breed any lioness they can get their hands on. About 10-40 lionesses are always having cubs in their dens. Let us use some math: 30 lionesses would give birth to average 60 cubs. They sell this all to the NPC and they get 6000SB, and all that all 3 days. On the other hand, if you put a cap and a limit, people would produce that additional cubs to get the SB, and sell the rest on the market. or at least they try to.

3. These cubs would always first land on the market, and after they dont sell, that is when they would use this feature. People who never mas-bred before would do so -including me. But hey, if I have good lions already, why dont I try to see if I can get more from the people on the market? The best solution would be to make sure that most of the bred cubs of mass-breeders would not land on the market at all. Say, chase the cubs on the very first day of their birth and your lioness comes into heat in 8 days -already suggested-, or the Survival bar which the developers suggested would solve it like snap -of course modified a bit at the Brood Mothers.

4. Also, I dont think that the high price of studs is a valid reason. Simply choose well what you want to do, choose better, cheaper studs, search more. Customize your males and females -which means income for the site- and create your own dream male which you can stud out and sell the cubs off, or buy the cubs of other people to achieve this. Studding to others' lions is no guarantee of income.

This suggestion would cause a lot more trouble for the economy than help.



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Edited on 22/12/14 by Axel (#6627)







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