Posted by Personality - Balance and More

Axel (#6627)

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Posted on
2015-09-21 20:30:37
Now, I really adore the thought behind the new Personality update. It makes us concentrate on a lot more things, gives more uses for toys and gives us yet another goal. To get those uncommon awesome Personalities. It gives yet another awesome use for karma.

However, it still needs a bit of tweaking.

Some personality categories need some work, need a good rebalance because some are worth a lot more than the others, and -according to the news post- now personalities can change slightly according to the main lion’s karma and so the promised boost of mood could be trashed just because the new cub had the awesome luck to have a Good Personality, while the rest of the pride is Kind...

So, let me introduce you to the problems and suggest a few ways to solve them.

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1. Good should also boost kind, kind should also boost good AND evil should also boost snarky, snarky should also boost evil.

Why? Because apparently there is some chance that your cubs will end up with either evil or good personality if your lion’s karma is high or low enough. This way it would unfair to have people suddenly lose the boosts just because their lion bred an uncommon personality, although they are still in the same ’category’. Otherwise the ‘uncommon’ personalities will be hated instead of wanted.

Kind is still good and snarky is still evil, and vice versa.

2. Swap around or change some of the personality effects. Some of them are generally useless, while some personality groups are clearly displaying an advantage over the others.

Let us see what rewards are given by category:

Kind:
+3% energy upon claim (cool) - Basically no energy loss from claiming.
+1 impression upon claim (cool) - Awesome impression boost. More imp=more stats
+5 SB/battle (cool) - More money is always cool.

VS

Snarky:
+5exp/battle (meh) - Good but highly limited by energy.
1x quest switch daily (cool) - Stuck at a quest? Be not afraid!
1x 30 energy/day (cool) - Awesome feature that gives you more gameplay time.

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Good:
boosted battle damage during day (cool) - Boosted damage is always welcome.
1x quest switch daily (cool) - Stuck at a quest? Be not afraid!
+2exp when chasing (meh?) - Only useful if you mass-chase lions.

VS

Evil:
0 energy loss when killing lion (useless) - For what? More evil karma? You already have Evil personality...
+1 impression upon claim (cool) - Awesome impression boost. More imp=more stats
1 carcass/day upon unsuccessful hunt (useless) - But all my hunts are successful... and carcass doesn’t seem to be so tempting...

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1. Any and all boosts that give these miserable little exp is useless (The one at Good is kind of can be useful if you have the patience to chase 300+ lions a day, whereas the one at Snarky is highly limited by energy). Especially when you reach higher levels they are nothing worth. Giving this ability to Good personality especially is a ripoff, since it is an uncommon one. But the one at Snarky is just as worthless if not more.

2. Since Good uncommon personality has boosted battle damage during daytime, one would expect that Evil uncommon personality offers the same during the night time. Why doesn’t it? It would make more sense (since it is a pretty good reward) instead of giving the nighttime one to neutral. It would balance things a bit more.

3. Those who get Evil personality are punished very hard by useless or worthless effects. The +1 impression is also available at the common Kind personality. Not much of a reward. The 1 carcass/unsuccessful hunt daily is extremely useless and worthless, due to 99% of all hunts being successful. So please, give them better effects, thanks, let us not even talk about the lion killing.

4. Kind and Good seem to be mostly awesome abilities for NPC fights, claiming and quests. Whereas Snarky and (especially) Evil concentrate almost solely on hunting(???) and quests and killing pride lions for even more bad karma, which will only net you the useless Evil personality. Oh wait, it doesn’t have anything worth your time, so why is that a reward in the first place? Shouldn’t they be balanced? Giving us the choice of effects that speak for our gameplay style? Especially seeing the uncommon Good VS Evil personality effects, one can tell which one is worth more. Balance it, please. Make it worth it to have an Evil lion as well.

As for Xylax’ explanation:
“Just like in games, let's say WoW, you want to play a Worgen but have a Dwarf race trait. But you can't.”
There is a tiny difference. That in WOW, all gameplay effects and traits are given and we can weigh the situation BEFORE choosing a path. In that case, if I wanted the Dwarf race traits, I would choose the race that gives me this trait. Unlike Lioden, where you let us choose our gameplay paths before introducing effects, which can make our chosen path disappointing. This is why we expect changes and balance in the effects.

“I don't think the mood loss is something that punishes you so bad for picking a Good personality while having evil lions ;) Just a bit more toys.”
Considering the fact that most of the awesome effects are at the Kind or Good personality, many people would love to get those, even if their lion has a major evil karma. Oh wait, their male lion has extra low evil karma and their cubs will end up evil because of this karma and now they lose their bonuses? Sure, let them just use more toys. They deserve it after all for having chosen bad karma all this time unpunished.

And if you have a large pride I'd assume you already use Play All.
So you made this feature, expecting everyone who has a large pride to have a GB feature already? Isnt this a disappointing train of thought?
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Anyway, thanks for reading.



This suggestion has 115 supports and 10 NO supports.



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Axel (#6627)

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Posted on
2015-09-29 22:18:31
Still have an effect, dont they? Visual or gameplay effects. It gives more variety, more choices, more interactions. Unlike the Leaderboards' nonexistent advantages and effects.

Good personality gives only gameplay effects. Evil persnality gives one gameplay effect, one that is useless because hunts are 99% successful and one that goes in circles. Now tell it is truly balanced. Put the two next to one another. That is all it takes. Whereas Good gives bonuses for many gameplay styles, Evil gets stuck at leaderboards. How is that balanced? I would expect such lower level bonuses at common personalities.

My alternative suggestion would be to make neutral completely untouched by karma, so if you have a neutral lion, its cubs should not be affected by karma and should stay neutral, this way making sure that some of us who arent happy with the new personalities can just choose neutral and stay that way forever without fearing for our only cub turning to a personality we dont want. If you want to change that, then simply put your male lion or a lioness you breed to another personality and karma can affect it again.
Everyone is happy.



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Katavi [Mhenga
Usafi] (#21119)

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Posted on
2015-09-29 22:31:31
Actually that suggestion is already true.

If you have only Neutral lions and do not gain karma one way or the other, the cubs have no chance to get "Good" or "Evil" personalities.

Other than by using the Personality Snake, the only way to get Good or Evil personalities is if your karma is very high toward Good or Evil.

As per Xylax's News Post
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Karma: Good and Evil personalities appear in cubs if your karma is high or low enough.

Breeding: Mom's and Dad's categories have equal chance to affect EACH cub in litter, and your karma has extra chance to affect on top of that. For example, if Main Lion is Heartless and lioness is Warm, each one of cubs has a chance to be either Evil or Kind, and get any personality from those categories!

Explore:If main male's personality category is matching claimable NCL's there's a chance she will join your pride without courtship!
---

So if you keep your karma fairly neutral, you will never get good or evil cubs. If all your pride is neutral, from what I'm understanding, you will only get neutral?

Neutral even has an advantage because many NCLs are Neutral. You can claim additional lionesses easier to build impression.



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Axel (#6627)

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Posted on
2015-09-29 23:27:51
My male lion has bad karma. For a reason. The choices of bad karma are more beneficial for me. Spending hundreds of SBs just to reset my karma every week is ridiculous.

Neutral isnt exactly going to cut it if my next litter will end up Snarky because of karma. This is the problem. So if I am forced to -in the end- participate in the personality thing, then I expect my own gamestyle to be supported as well. Not just leaderboard-hunters.



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Katavi [Mhenga
Usafi] (#21119)

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Posted on
2015-09-29 23:44:38
That is your choice though. You don't have to build Karma. You can simply ignore karma events in Explore if you wish to. You're choosing to build karma. If you choose to participate in it than it's not really the mechanic's fail. You can't always have your cake and eat it too.



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Axel (#6627)

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Posted on
2015-09-30 00:18:18
But the game mechanics are supposed to help me in my gameplay, REWARD me for my hard work and not give me useless stuff. While others actually get what they want. Isnt that unfair?
And ignoring karma interactions is asking me to not explore, which is a huge part of gameplay if not the very base of it. I chose to play but I also want to get appropriate rewards for my gameplay. That is not too much, nor illogical to ask.
If I work for that cake, then I am supposed to eat it as well. Or how would you feel if everyone else got a cake and you were given a handful of dried flies instead, even though you did the same hard work.



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Katavi [Mhenga
Usafi] (#21119)

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Posted on
2015-09-30 00:35:28
Once again, you're judging it simply by your own standards. The game is designed to please most people. It's not just to please me or you.

And what do you mean "everyone else gets what they want"? You have just as many options as everyone else. You're the one demanding something change because you'd rather have it be the way you want instead of the way it is. It seems like most people are just fine with Heartless being the way it is? Most people seem fine with Evil being the way it is?

You are scarcely getting a "handful of flies" and no, karma is not that big a deal. You were the one saying it was useless and meant nothing just a few posts ago. You do not have to do anything with karma. Most Explore interactions are fights and NCLs and event interactions. Most event interactions do not even build karma.

You are the one refusing to adapt to the way the game works unfortunately. You are not "working for the cake". The cake is free. It is a free game that caters to many types of game play. There are several personalities that can do just fine for your personal game play. You do not have to be "Evil". You can be Snarky and get the bonuses you want and whatever Karma you want. And you might potentially and randomly get an Evil cub. You are not forced to keep said cub; plus you can change the personality if you so choose.

You are complaining as if you only have one option. You have several. The Admins can't please everyone and you have to adapt to the way the game works. Yes, you can make suggestions but just because you want it doesn't mean it will happen. You either have to adapt and see what changes happen or you can stop playing. I am not saying you have to, but that's pretty much all you can do. You can work with the system, see what happens, or you can just decide the game isn't for you.

This isn't a matter of getting "a handful of flies" while everyone gets cake. This is them having an ice cream party with ten different flavors, but you deciding that none of those flavors are the one you want. So instead of choosing an option, you're complaining that the one particular flavor you want isn't there, even though it's a totally free ice cream party. You can certainly request the flavor, but given that it's free, if they say "We don't have that", you can either pick an ice cream or get none.

I get you want your favorite flavor, but hey, it's still free ice cream. Personally, I'd pick the flavor I like best out of the options and enjoy the party.



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Edited on 30/09/15 @ 07:35:54 by Haidar [The Ndona Pride] (#21119)

Kimiko Kyuuketsuki (#32476)

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Posted on
2015-09-30 00:41:10
Karma has advantages even if you don't focus on Karma....

Karma expansions in Explore to get items like whit lion pelts

Karma gives titles

Karma effects personalities

I actually was displeased when I seen that there was not a "good" version of the " no energy loss from killing" and just because you don't agree doesn't mean your thread has to be nothing but a fight about it. You can just " agree to disagree" and focus on the other points you are making because other than "Karma is useless" I agree with you, but I can't see any discussions about anything but why karma is good or bad which is a shame.



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Axel (#6627)

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Posted on
2015-09-30 00:52:18
Aye. I already said what needs to be said about karma. And I am not interested to carry on with that debate.
I would say the same thing over and over and over again.

And just a tiny little detail: You can get the pelt even with good or bad karma. It just gives you bad karma in return and titles arent exactly doing anything either. Not really an effect. And the fact, that Evil personality gives me bad karma just to give me evil personality is another thing I am concerned about.

I would love to see something done about the evil personality effects and am curious what other effects will be added. Because I expect Evil to get more significant additional effects compared to Good to balance out the current effects.



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Kimiko Kyuuketsuki (#32476)

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Posted on
2015-09-30 00:55:01
( never seen the white lion lol)

I for one love your idea about giving boosts to snarky/evil and kind/good. Lets talk about how awesome that would be =3 I like the idea of good giving a smaller boost to kind but still boosting them.



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Axel (#6627)

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Posted on
2015-09-30 01:01:39
Yep. My thought behind that was that karma now affects what personality your cubs get. Currently (if the boosts stay the way they are) people will pray they wont get the uncommons because that would destroy the mood boosts and they would need to pay money almost at every generation. Whereas the developers -I believe- wanted them to be sought after, thus they should not exactly negate the boost.

I agree that they probably wont boost each other at full potential but maybe half would be already enough.

Edit: What if Good boosts Kind and Evil boosts Snarky as they would their own, but the other way around only a smaller boost is given? I mean Good and Evil are uncommon and higher valued personalities, arent they? They surely have a more powerful effect.



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Edited on 30/09/15 @ 08:07:48 by Axel (#6627)

Katavi [Mhenga
Usafi] (#21119)

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Posted on
2015-09-30 01:36:52
I actually mentioned that earlier. My thoughts were Kind/Snarky boosts 5% for the same and 3% for the Good/Evil. What if Good/Evil boosts 5% overall for like for being rarer?

Although currently the personality boosts are bugged.



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Axel (#6627)

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Posted on
2015-09-30 01:54:34
Yes but only in their corresponding categories. Opposite categories would lose 10% accordingly. Which brings us to the penalties. I think it should work the same way. Good reduces mood of opposite lions (Evil and Snarky) by 10%. But kind only gives a 5% mood drop to Evil? Same goes to Snarky, which would drop the mood of Good lions by 5%. After all, those two are special, right? They shouldnt be so easily affected.
I am not quite so sure about this one, though.



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Muffinrowlet 🌸 (#37042)

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Posted on
2015-10-28 02:13:22
I agree that there should be a mood boost. My king is Evil and most of my lions have a snarky personality, but it's totally useless since they don't have the boost.

I also agree that there should be more beneficial evil personalities. I don't care much that I changed my king's personality to heartless (got the mask for SB) but it only matters if you want to get on a leaderboard, really. And that personality that gets you +1 carcass a day? Only useful in events such as the drought and great hunger(? Can't remember if successful hunting rates drop in that one), otherwise it's really easy to get plenty of carcasses (though this might change when the lionesses personalities affect gameplay?)



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