Referencing - what is okay

Normal Referencing - multiple inspirations, where final outcome is different enough, while influenced by used references in meaning of anatomy, perspective, shading, colours, or anything that can inspire.




( ^ credit to Flareon for this one!)

Close Reference

Explanation:
Here you can see the original picture being the reference. However, the outcome has differences which I marked with a brush. This means the person deviated from the original enough that the final art is different, and thus their own - however it would be nice if they linked back to the inspiration they used.

I prepared this some time ago as explanation to my mods why I considered this not an copy, when we received a report. I do not remember the original artist, so forgive me, but they are a player on Lioden.

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Remember that when artist posts traced art on Lioden and claim as own, they are breaking the rules and infringe copyrights, and thus such art can be used for educational purposes. However, if the artist wants it taken down please PM me. I think by sharing this way, you give back to community, so up to you.

Tracing

Following are examples of lineart/art overlays matching the original photos exactly. Sometimes it's difficult to match them when photo has been rotated or skewed, however not impossible.
These are okay if you plan to exhibit your art as practice/gallery, but they NEED to be credited with original link back to the artist. Traced images cannot generate profit on Lioden.

Copying

Just as above, but copying does not always mean a trace. Let me explain on each picture.




Here, artist of the smaller cub on the left wanted to submit this as a custom decor. However, the face and backarea of the cub was a copy of our Extra Limbs mutation.






Here, the serval is a possible trace, while some parts of the body like tail or markings are different.





Here, the lioness head had the outline and general anatomy traced, however the eyes were made bigger, and mouth placed a bit lower. It is still a copy.








Here, the cub is copied exactly from the original photo. It might not be traced at all, however the pose and proportions are a perfect match - and thus become a copy.





Here, the outline seems to be a trace or a very close eyeballing. Leg and ear placement show perfect match, while the tail and mane are artist's invention. Unfortunately this still breaks the copyright.





Here, the pose was traced, however the muzzle and tail were deviated. While not being a perfect trace, it still is a copy that breaks the rules.

Eyeballing

Eyeballing is copying a picture without tracing or gridding. Here's an example:




You can notice the overlay shows the picture is not a match in terms of tracing. There's enough deviation in the paw and proportions to be different. However, it is clearly visible it's still a copy of the original photo, and thus, this is breaking the rules.

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I’m really curious: would someone be allowed to trace/eyeball a photo that they took themselves, since they own that photo? Cause then there wouldn’t be a copyright infringement, right?

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Hi Xylax! This thread it´s very helpful and I have some questions don´t know if you can answer, one of them being the difference from referencing and Frankesteining/frankendolling because I can understand some aspects on their difference and some are very obvious but in your example of the bettles it´s not very clear for me At least because in my eyes it´s like the first bettle the back (or bottom) it´s like an Eyeballing or Copying of the first image (on the left) at the bottom of the collage, and in the same pose, using the one or two legs from the one that it´s at it´s right (and even the pose too because it´s pretty similar except for it being slighlty up? dont know if I´m expleining myself well sorry ), just that the head it´s of course a reference of one of the heads of the other pictures but the essence and body are not eyeballing?

I´m asking this not just for animal or insects but also for human or humanoid drawings (this last it´s the most I like to do) and sometimes it´s difficult to tell when one it´s refercing and not doing eyeballing. For example when one studies anatomy one have a model but we don´t have that chance of having one and if do not all the time (specially with animals and their anatomy, one can try to use cats and other domestic animals but it´s not always the same), so there´s where pictures enter and with the anatomy or poses when those two concepts aply? If I chose a pose to create my character but it´s wont end in that but it will have wings, horns, many arms and it´s your character, your creation, but the pose of a human and of a pic it would still be tracing or eyeballing? And for example if one draws a figth, we are not martial arts master so we use reference and poses (some are pre existing poses, like if we look on interenet poses for males, females, figths and all there are bunch) so it would still be eyeballing or tracing? (becasuse at the end martial art have or need to have that pose if not it would not be that art or fighting stand, it would have small diference like the paw in your eyeballing example, and I thing expression doesn´t really count for it all to be ayeballing or does it? )

Also in the first example, with the maned wolf you said it was still a copy or eyeball picture and I get that but what happens if the expression change to grumpy and maybe it´s a mystical wolf with eyes and the mouth it´s not of wolf but a crocodile, but still has the ears because that´s why one looks for that picture to know in that direction of the head where and how the other ear would look like, it would still be trace or eyeballing?

I have seen also that in some comics the own artist use references and some are like eyeballing or tracings or Frankesteining of them but with of course the hero or villian characte (one artist even took his own pictures to use them drawing the character) but it´s not like at the end of the comic they like put at the end or back where they took the reference from so in that sense where does the tracing/eyeballing/frankesteining enter and maybe even the legal part of it enter, on where someone Must or Can choose to share where they took a pic or pics from.

Maybe I´m going a bit too much of the legal part with the last question than just the rules on lioden but if you know I would like you to answer it please! And I´m sorry, this is too long and there are a lot of questions too, it´s just I didn´t knew if ask here or make a modbox ticket

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if i were to want to make a decor (like ears) that are based off an NPCs ears would that be allowed? (i was wanting to make some sort of nirah ears)

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Would tracing a bit of anatomy for your drawing to be better, be okay?

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I struggle to see the problem with Eyeballing as long as it’s from an actual image and not someone else’s art. In the end you’re still depending on your art skills for it, you just have a better sense of proportions and the pose you want. What is genuinely wrong with that?

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how would we go about crediting references in a CD?

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If someone posted traced, stolen, and/or eyeballing artwork (as a reference, etc), are you allowed to report the person/the thread/both?

Also, I'm assuming that websites like Picrew can not be used or claimed as the posters' art either?

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@Moom Yea you report the thread, picrew images aren't allowed to be sold or any art that doesn't belong to you, that also includes OC's/adopts, unless you have permission


Is AI art allowed to be sold? I've seen this as a new thing on here

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@Anxiety Prime

Regarding AI: We do not accept AI-generated submissions. If we suspect AI tools have been used to create a submission, it will be rejected and we will expect a detailed WIP example with stages of your artwork to prove otherwise.

in custom decor rules ^^

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Thanks! Was unsure if I should report the threads or not!

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If I wanted to make art of my pets, would I be allowed to use a photo or should I come up with a different stance and color it to my pets liking?

The pets I have is a German Shepherd mix, German Shorthaired Pointer, Red Eared Slider and California kingsnake. Just to give you an idea of what I would be drawing

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@Animedubya

As long as you don't plan on selling the art here on LioDen you should be okay since it's also your photo

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Would making a female version of an existing mane be considered eyeballing or otherwise against the rules? I’m trying to use similar shapes to read as the mane type I want, so I’ve referenced the male version pretty heavily (as well as a few other manes/decors to figure out shading and line weight and such)… but it’s also been pretty heavily modified to fit a female pose and I’ve drawn it all by hand. Please let me know!

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