Posted by -ADDED TO THE GAME-Reverse studding ~ Making it reliable

xXDruidXx (#74535)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 07:54:19
Okay so it's come to my attention that not all of the reverse studders stick to their word and end up keeping the cubs if it is proven to be a dwarf or leopon etc. Which in my opinion seems very scam-like. As if no mutie is produce they earn 50-100gb of stuff, if a mutie is produced then they send the items back and come up with an excuse to keep the cub. With the current rules admins and mods won't do anything about this themselves, except possibly ban a scammer, but it's not their job to return lions etc! Which I understand completely, I wouldn't want to have to deal with stuff like that either XD

I'm certainly not saying every studder is like this, some of them are awesome and completely reliable <3 But unfortunately not all are!

My suggestion is that there is a more formal way of reverse studding! How? I'll use a leopon as an example.
.There would be a way to put your 'pon up for stud as a female lioness. She will be put up and like a trade, there will be a buyout and ways to offer items etc!
.The payment will only be made once she get's pregnant to prevent paying for nothing XD The payer will choose the stud from a list, or use their own king.
.Once the leopon is pregnant, the lioness can't be traded, sold etc, she must stay on that persons account, like how cooldowns work, but for a longer time!
.The cubs she gives birth to can't be sold/chased and they must stay on the account until they're old enough to leave the mother.
.When the cubs are old enough they will be automatically sent over to the person who paid.

I am definitely not saying that's how it should be done! So don't "no support" due to that, instead suggest your ideas on how this would work ^-^ I am no professional coder, so don't expect me to know how easy this would be!
Please suggest ideas and give your support! It greatly help those who want to reverse breed but have been scammed in the past or are two nervous to reverse breed due to unreliability!
Don't say things like this don't happen, they do and it happened to a friend of mine!

Thank you ^-^

Suggestions ~
Mish 🐾 (#82643) ~ What if instead of making it so they couldn't be chased or moved from the account during the five days of nursing, it was possible to transfer them earlier to *only* the reverse studee with the requirement of having the nursing cub protected by a broodmother (to function somewhat as a "wet nurse", so to speak.)
^^ That would prevent the studder neglecting the cubs, by not protecting them etc!

The owner of the stud would decide how many cubs the payer can choose out of, when they're born the buyer would pick their favourite cub, the rest would belong to the owner of the stud. So if something like two leopon cubs occurred, the stud owner doesn't have to give them both!

Studding weekly limits, like kings have now.


Most of the arguments made for problems, already exist, please. If you have no experiance in 'pon breeding what so ever don't make an argument about 'pon breeding. Also, don't make arguments for things that already happen. Instead, suggest ways these problems could also be stopped!



This suggestion has 171 supports and 29 NO supports.



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Edited on 24/02/17 @ 03:17:07 by xXDruidXx (#74535)

Mish 🐾 [G1 Primal
Leonid] (#82643)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:06:19
Support!

I've never personally participated in reverse studding, so my ideas may not be fully functional, but! I thought I'd toss them here just in case they kinda made sense! I also don't know enough about coding to know if this is feasible, so!

What if instead of making it so they couldn't be chased or moved from the account during the five days of nursing, it was possible to transfer them earlier to *only* the reverse studee with the requirement of having the nursing cub protected by a broodmother (to function somewhat as a "wet nurse", so to speak.)

I say this mainly because it seems?? Like lioden doesn't typically support the idea of making it impossible for lions to run off if ignored! (Feel free to correct me if this is the case!)



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xXDruidXx (#74535)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:13:07
Thank you!
Mish I was thinking of something like that, as the studder may neglect the cubs, I'll add your suggestion now ^-^



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Mei (#53317)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:28:25
I think it would just be easier to have a rule clarification, rather than implement this complex new system.
Possibly something like, "Reverse studdings must follow the same rules as regular male studdings. The player buying the studding owns the entire litter, no matter what is produced."

There might be some issues regarding aging stone costs and such, but I think a rule clarification would be much needed and helpful.



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Knox (#36129)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:29:32
So, like when the lioness is "bought" for the breeding and goes to the other person, person B's account, they just chill for the 3 days to give birth. After that, why not (on top of locking her down so she cant be chased and neither can the cubs) make it so she's instantly returned to person A's account?

Like the deed is done, 3 days go by, and when person B logs in to rollover, by next rollover, lioness and cubs included are launched back to person A.



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xXDruidXx (#74535)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:30:46
Mei, I like the idea of your suggestion, but things will still happen and I quote (This is a recent post from here http://www.lioden.com/topic.php?id=304429258279)
"Promise transactions will not be moderated any more, and it is at the players' own risk to be involved. We will ban scammers if and when reported, but we will not be obliged to return any lost items, currency, lions, beetles, etc. if lost in a promise transaction.
"



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xXDruidXx (#74535)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:32:14
Calcifer, the way I thought of it, the lioness wouldn't move accounts! She'd stay on the owners account on lockdown XD The cubs would then be automatically sent over when they're old enough!



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Mei (#53317)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:32:51
Yes, I read that - however my suggestion is a modification to that rule/statement. While I thought it would be common sense that a player buying a studding automatically owns the entire litter, I've seen so many people doing otherwise that I feel this greed and bad taste should be taken into account by the admins.



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Knox (#36129)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:34:24
;-; how does that work tho...i thought reverse studding was sending the female over to get preggers and give birth on a different king's account


Ohh so what you're suggesting is essentially that your female gets preggers by another king on your account, and the cubs when born are sent to their father's account?



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xXDruidXx (#74535)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:35:11
Mei, I agree with you! But it will be difficult for mods and admins to make sure no one is breaking these rules. For example the owner of the 'pon may delete their thread making it terribly difficult for admins to trace back to what actually happened!

If studding male to female can be done "safely", then why can't reverse studding be made reliable to



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xXDruidXx (#74535)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:37:05
Calcifer yep!

Reverse studding is where someone like a 'pon owner will get paid to breed their 'pon and send over the cubs, as they're worth a lot and not everyone can get a 'pon themselves!
Unfortunately there is nothing stopping them from keeping the cubs and scamming the other users!



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Bezthiel 🍉 (#81210)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:37:54
I don't reverse stud, so I have no idea what to do about it, but it should definitely be something. It's typically used in such expensive breedings that getting soured on it can have a huge impact on relatively small but pricey parts of the economy (stat breedings, leopon breedings, likely tigon breedings in the future).

But... building on Calicifer's idea, what if mom could bet sent to the buyers account. She couldn't be sold, transferred, chased, killed, or reserved, until the cubs are no longer attached to her, and the moment she's no longer nursing cubs, she gets sent back to the seller's account.

It'd be up to the buyer and seller to decide if the resulting cubs would be aged, killed, or if they're both willing to wait those 5 days. But at least the buyer would actually get to keep the whole litter they paid (this is why I won't do it. Too many sellers want to claim my money, cubs, and items. It's bad taste, like Mei says) for and the seller wouldn't have to worry about their lioness ending up forever on someone else's account.



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Edited on 23/02/17 @ 15:39:38 by Bezthiel (#81210)

xXDruidXx (#74535)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:37:59
I see 2 no supports, please, tell me why so I can see if the suggestion can be improved.

Edit: Because the only reason I can currently see for not supporting is if you're one of those who try to cheat people out of rare cubs/items/gb/sb ;)



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Edited on 23/02/17 @ 15:42:43 by xXDruidXx (#74535)

Knox (#36129)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:38:13
Oh alright! ouo ive never done a reverse studding so i was never really 100% sure what they even were, i just knew you had to send your female away like if the king ran out of studding slots



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xXDruidXx (#74535)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:39:56
Bezthiel, thank you!
I thought it'd be better if the leopon etc was kept on the real owners account as many won't want to see it taken to someone else's account and people can fake that it's their lioness and try cheat people into buying it, expecially if it's rare like a 'pon or dwarf etc!



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xXDruidXx (#74535)

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Posted on
2017-02-23 08:41:09
Calcifer no problem ^-^
There's some reverse studding posts in the sales threads, so you could take a look there if you wanted an actual example



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