Posted by Fixing Combo Bases [+309/-13]

jester [im autistic]
☘️ | 🇵🇸 (#187561)


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Posted on
2023-05-23 23:51:35
Currently, Combo Bases are a bit... odd. Not only are they mostly borderline worthless, no one really wants to breed for them because it's so incredibly demoralizing. The chances of them passing are absurdly low, it's been estimated at a mere 2% via scries, no matter the factors used, and currently, even selling bred combo bases is a pain in the ass. Most are worth at most 10GB (though usually worth around 3-5), with the most expensive bases being the June Combo Bases, which aren't even bought at the prices they're listed at, they're just so high because it's impossible to breed them.

"Jester, how are you going to fix them?" Simple. Stay with me, alright? It's a three step process.

1. Increase the rates of combo bases spawning from breedings of the Combo x Any Factor. For example, a Hellebore x Goldenrod breeding would have a 3% (or maybe 4%) chance for Hellebore, rather than the 2% chance it has currently, which is identical to a Lilac x Goldenrod breeding.

2. Increase rates of the Combo x the Combo breedings. This would mean a Hellebore x Hellebore breeding would be a 4% chance for Hellebore, rather than the same 2% chance it currently is.

3. Make Combo Bases Passable at a reduced rate.

Wait, what? Let's expand on 3 a bit. As seen with hybrid bases, making rare and hard to obtain bases passable usually doesn't devalue them all that much. Kimanjano and Mandarin still sell for a good 25-30GB, on average, and they have mechanics that increase their pass rate in certain breedings, and have a reduced pass rate in all others. This is what I would want Combo Bases to become. To give an example, let's go back to breeding Hellebore. There would be four methods to be a Hellebore breeder:
1. Having a Lilac King and breeding to Goldenrod and Udara Lionesses, for a 2% chance at spawning Hellebore cubs.
2. Having a Hellebore King and breeding to Lilac, Goldenrod, and Udara Lionesses, for a 3% chance at spawning Hellebore cubs.
3. Having a Hellebore King and breeding to other Hellebore Lionesses, for a 4% chance at Hellebore cubs
4. Having a Hellebore King and mass breeding to non-factor lionesses, for a 0.5% to 1% chance to produce Hellebore depending on the lioness's genetic rarity label. Just like Kimanjano and Mandarin function (confirmed to be half of the rate of other specials on the hybrid wiki page).

It's also rather annoying that a lot of combos can't reliably fail into some of their factors when you attempt to breed them with certain combinations, or when you're mass breeding them. This makes it hard to sustain combo breeding, as you'll end up eventually always having to buy factors, for example, Qahir x Qahir cannot fail into anything that is useable for the combo, other than Qahir, the same can be said for Arabica. Combos should have an increased chance to fail into their factors, and also have a chance to spontaneously generate a common, uncommon, or rare factor from the breeding, similar to how Albino can randomly appear from any breeding. This would only apply to non-special factors, Special factors would still need a parent with the base to appear.

Adding in to say the Combo Base roll should roll before the special base pass rate, as it's annoying that potential combo rolls can get blocked by specials in the breeding passing.

Feel free to let me know your thoughts below! If you No Support, be sure to let me know why. While I understand a lot of you may be against the changing of combo bases, I believe making them passable naturally will, if anything, help their incredibly low values and make breeding them far more accessible. Value isn't just determined by rarity, but also by the demand. Currently, there is very little demand to breed combo bases solely because of the way they function, so I feel addressing these functions might make the popularity of combo bases go up, and, in turn, their value as well. Thank you for reading!

EDIT: Adding a bit of reasoning for Number 3 - it's because currently, every other combo trait in game works like this, where the traits that make them need to be bred and, from there, the traits can be passed down either normally (in the case of Royal Mane & Mane Colors), or at a low rate, like Sectoral Eyes. Combo Markings in Wolvden also work identically to this as well, where once they're bred they can be passed down like any other markings. While I think allowing combo bases to pass identically to other specials would flood the market after a few months, I think a reduced rate equal to Kimanjano and Mandarin would help bring value back and alleviate some of the pain associated with combo breeding.

ADDING MORE
I also think Combos should have a higher chance to fail into their factors than any other common/uncommon/rare, similar to how Albino lions have an elevated chance to pass Albino. More detail on this has been added above.



This suggestion has 442 supports and 20 NO supports.



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Edited on 13/11/23 @ 07:43:50 by jester [im autistic] ☘️ (#187561)

☾Seidhr☽ | G2
OutlawRLC (#47547)

Lone Wanderer
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Posted on
2023-05-24 00:02:55
Yes please, anything to help with combo breeding. Been breeding souls for two years now and it's insanely painful, spent thousands in gb to get diddly squat, or even factors FOR soul base instead of just.. The base, it's insanely painful and demoralizing.



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⛰️Iolaire G1
Cairngorm Primal (#156600)

Brave
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Posted on
2023-05-24 00:14:59
I love breeding for combo bases, I love the excitement of planning it out, but it is frustrating sometimes just how hard it is to do, and just how little worth they have when you do succeed. I've heard so many stories of people with lovely combo base lionesses who never once passed despite pairing with the right stud every single heat, or kings that pair with the right lionesses but produce so few combo offspring, and a market that just doesn't care that much about those lions. When it's SO hard to get, the interest in going after it wanes, and lions that take so much work to create (like, I dunno, a G1 combo base king with a ton of BO attributes >.>) get passed over for studs more likely to pass their base. Honestly I was getting 2, maybe 3 stud requests a week for my boy and the only thing that changed lately was that I changed him to crested mane for the punk challenge, and only then did I start selling out slots again. I'm not exactly setting out to make bank off stud fees here (though it would be nice), I just want to see more of the obscure combo bases have new life breathed into them, instead of the applicator bases winning the popularity contest because they're so much easier to get.

A Cairngorm x Cairngorm passing better than factor x factor would be ideal. Reward the people who put the effort in to get the base to begin with by making it pass easier, on par with other special passes.

And a very small chance of a combo base passing in a normal breeding rather than when bred to a factor would be quite welcome. Currently I either have to luck out finding a chased with the right base, or apply an app to an NCL/chased to get a G1 factor to breed with my king, but if I had a tiny chance that breeding with any ol NCL could result in a G2 cairngorm, I would be thrilled.

So yes, full support, I would like for there to be incentive to breed combos again in the form of just a little bit more success at doing it!



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才藤 (#389089)


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Posted on
2023-05-24 03:03:52



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Edited on 17/09/23 @ 18:51:13 by 才藤 (#389089)

DROPKVCK | G2 Unique
Ivory (#1754)


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Posted on
2023-05-24 04:49:28
Please, sweet christ, please <3



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Ghilanain [frozen] (#129572)

Bone Collector
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Posted on
2023-05-24 04:54:53
I highly support increased chances of passing the base when breeding the combo base itself to either factors or itself, 10000%. I think a combo + combo 4% would be more than fair, since that’s what regular special bases get.

I do not, however support the base randomly passing from a parent that has it when bred to a non-factor; it defeats the purpose of combo base breeding in my opinion. Supported the topic though <3



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jester [im autistic]
☘️ | 🇵🇸 (#187561)


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Posted on
2023-05-24 06:52:04
The justification for including 3, to me, is comparing it to Combo Eyes / Combo Manes and Combo Markings in Wolvden. Combo Eyes have to be bred from their factors first, and past that, they can be passed down like normal, though they tend to have a much smaller chance compared to normal eyes passing, the same with Combo Manes (though Royal passes at about the exact same rate as other manes, there’s still no numbers out to confirm). Combo Markings also work similarly in WD, where once the marking is bred it passes down like normal!

While the Sectoral Eyes and Cosmic aren’t worth much, this is also because you can reliably pass eyes to every cub in the litter using Eye Rocks. Royal Mane is much more valuable comparatively, especially when in conjunction with other valued traits.

I understand it’s a personal taste thing though! I just think that the reduced rate is a happy medium, and would honestly maybe help bring value into some of the more worthless combos with dedicated fans and bad factors, like Squall, which only has 70 lions in game, Hellebore, Sphinx, and more like it. Though Sphinx is just cursed with having a relatively unpopular set of June bases as it’s factors.



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🌼 the serval
spots (#102356)

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Posted on
2023-05-24 06:54:08
fuck yea



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Quit (#412633)

Lone Wanderer
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Posted on
2023-05-29 10:38:48
Fuckin support, its so annoying trying to get my snowflake gal to pass her fuckin base when I breed her to a snowflake, frostbitten, or albino stud



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✨Alison✨🏳️&
zwj;🌈 g2 ice 3r
cloud (#312345)

Heavenly
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Posted on
2023-05-29 10:38:53
As a combo breeder, yeah this would make life...less ugh



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Lunar Lords (#86479)

Brave
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Posted on
2023-06-04 19:36:18
Support. Elysian is gorgeous but I got rid of my Elysian breed only marked king on my other account because Combo's can't pass themselves without extemely expensive investment.



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MangoCrow’s
side (#333123)

Bone Collector
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Posted on
2023-08-17 23:40:40
I support all of it except part 3.4, I think breeding a combo base to a non-factor shouldn’t pass and should still be limited to combo factors, but the rest of it would be FANTASTIC



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Juno 🌈 | G1
10.7.22 rlc (#392199)

Impeccable
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Posted on
2023-09-09 13:07:03
I love the June bases and their combos so much, but with the price of even clean factors it is a serious commitment to try and get into with very little possibility of reward.

Please consider this change or at the very least parts of it! There should especially be some incentive to have combo bases as kings since currently they are better used as females and that’s a bummer since so many are so pretty!



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🌺The Hibiscus
Curse🌺 (#253145)

Phoenix
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Posted on
2023-09-11 14:22:35
Support! it's such a pain in the ass I don't even bother anymore.



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stanley 🌲 g1
banana ruffian (#418835)


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Posted on
2023-10-05 14:08:07
combos failing into factors makes so much sense



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TheGreatIndoors -
ΘΔ (#241837)


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Posted on
2023-10-06 19:37:05
Oh my god PLEASE. Combo breeding as it is is absolute agony... Either this, or some kind of breeding item that increases the chances like a Pennyroyal would or something



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