Posted by Auctions MUST Have End Date

GamingGal (#18503)

Sapphic
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Posted on
2015-12-25 07:48:15
I'm tired of seeing this popping up, and it seems to be an issue sometimes, so I have a suggestion. Mind you, I know there is a suggestion for an Auction House. This suggestion is for in case that isn't implemented (or as a stand-in until it is).

With auctions right now, the seller has the right to do whatever they want. They can change the date, not set an end date, end it with no winner, all sorts of things. That shouldn't be so. I think the site needs to create more control over it, and below are rules that I feel should be added to the ToS:

--Auctions MUST have an end date stated in the MAIN post.
Once the end date is stated, there is a 24hr grace period to change it in case you typed the wrong date or something comes up in life.

--If an edit is required, a "flag to edit" option will be available for use
This will require a small bit of coding, but it would work a lot like the "Report" function. You will flag your post, and will be taken to a page where you have to state WHY you want to edit the auction. It will go to the mods where they can approve/deny it, and give a reason if needed.

--If the end date lists a specific hour, it must be in LD time
This will cut down on any potential confusion between time zones.

--The seller cannot back out of an auction unless for a reason proven valid by a moderator
Too many sellers are adding the clause of "I can end if it doesn't sell for enough!" and that's not how auctions work. An auction's starting bid should be the lowest amount you would be content with accepting. Being able to end it simply because you didn't like the price it reached by the end date is nothing but price gouging.
--The seller may cancel the auction if there are no bids after 3 days of the auction being live.

--There should be repercussions for refusing to pay/refusing to send items won
If an auction runs to the end time and a winner is evident, the seller should be required to hand over the items/lions for the final bid price. On the other hand, the buyer should be required to stand buy their bid and not back out. If this cannot happen, the side who resigns should face some sort of punishment, be it a warning or something.
--The seller would have a 7-10 day grace period to send the item once the auction ends since life is a thing and we shouldn't punish people for having lives.

--If a bidder decides to withdraw, they MUST tell the seller
The bidder should not be allowed to withdraw from an auction unless they tell the seller. If the seller is not informed, the bid is still considered valid.

-------------------------------

Thoughts?

NOTE: this thread has been edited to reflex the ideas and feelings I was receiving from others. Although it differs from the original, the main concept I was focused on is still there.



This suggestion has 24 supports and 64 NO supports.



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Edited on 29/12/15 @ 00:30:40 by GamingGal [LHL] (#18503)

NegCol (#71390)

Merciful
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Posted on
2015-12-25 08:01:05
Edit: Changed to Support

No support.

I don't feel that not allowing people to edit their posts would help much of anything. Just because you can't edit the text doesn't mean that the auction runner will actually sell the item to the high bidder, end it at the specified time, etc.

Reasons I've edited auctions:
- Add the current high bidder
- Added links
- Added more pictures
- Reworded the rules to be more clear
- Raised the minimum increase for auctions that reached 1gb
- Added a snipe guard
- Added more lions
- Deleted lions that were auto-bought
- Fixed formatting issues

I can't imagine having to message a mod for any of that. Way too time and labor intensive.



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Edited on 27/12/15 @ 01:54:12 by NegCol (Resolute Stud; IRIS) (#71390)

GamingGal (#18503)

Sapphic
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Posted on
2015-12-25 17:09:00
-Add links
-Add more pictures
-Reword rules
-Add snipe guard
-Fix formatting
^^^^^
All the above things are details that should be fixed thoroughly before you even make the post. Instead of slapping words on a post and calling it an auction, people should actually put some thought into it. Do they want to sell the item? Have you considered people sniping? Is the formatting good? You know, there is a preview button for a reason.

-Add current high bidder
^^^^^^
It doesn't take a lot to find the last post if someone is serious about bidding

-Add lions
-Delete lions
^^^^
Why not have them all in the main post and let people bid on separate ones? "Bidding 3GB on Lion X" And as I stated above, people could see what has been AB'd by looking at previous posts. The "delete lions" part is the one thing I could see being an issue, but I'm sure a solution could be found.

-Raise min increase
^^^^
Your min increase should be the minimum you would be WILLING to accept as an increase. There shouldn't be a need to edit it.

-----------------------------

I've been on a site that had a dedicated subsection of a forum for auctions and it followed a lot of the above rules. It had even stricter ones, actually. However, people never had issues with auctions. Owners of the items/creatures always went through on their word, and bidders never backed out. Why? Because it wasn't allowed. Things were stricter, sure, but things also went a lot smoother and no one complained. In fact, it worked out better. Things here are so.....lax. If an owner of the item doesn't like the bidding, they can just close it down without much issue. End dates don't even have to be specified! And even if they are, the auction runner can change it at will.



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NegCol (#71390)

Merciful
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Posted on
2015-12-25 17:49:50
You know, there is a preview button for a reason.
I honestly hate how the preview button works on this site, the layout always seems not-true to how it actually posts. I prefer to post (normally with a title of Under Construction or some such) & edit. "Slapping words on a post and calling it an auction" isn't what I do (or at least I hope not), but if people are asking questions that are answered in the the post then obviously I should change it to make it more noticeable. Mistakes can be made and refinements should be allowed.

It doesn't take a lot to find the last post if someone is serious about bidding
But if you want to actually sell something, making it easy for the buyer is a good thing. If I'm selling 10 cubs, I shouldn't make the buyer who is interested in 1 cub trawl through pages of comments to see what the highest bid is.

Why not have them all in the main post and let people bid on separate ones?
I do have all the lions in the main post, but cubs are born or aged up and it's convenient to add them at the beginning of an auction rather than wait and hold another auction.

And as I stated above, people could see what has been AB'd by looking at previous posts
I think you're giving way too much credit to auction buyers. Almost no one does this and if it were required I could see buyers either not bothering to bid at all or just throwing a number out there to see if it stuck.

Your min increase should be the minimum you would be WILLING to accept as an increase.
Yeah, that was my bad on my one auction. I didn't expect anyone to be interested enough to go beyond a few hundred sb. When it was in the sb prices, 10sb was a reasonable increase. Once it reached 1 gb? Not so much.

But still, none of this answers how this would actually make the auctioneer sell their lions/items for that price. Just because they can't edit a post doesn't mean they can't ignore it and refuse to sell. How did this other site actually police the auctions and ensure that the auctioneers sold their items at the specified price?



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ClockKey (#74714)

Heavenly
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Posted on
2015-12-25 17:53:16
No support. I wouldn't want to send a message to a mod and wait forever for an answer every time just to edit the current bidder in. :/



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GamingGal (#18503)

Sapphic
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Posted on
2015-12-25 18:03:50
The site I was on treated an auction like a contract. Once it was made, it could not be changed. Once it ended, the seller had to relinquish the creature and the buyer had to provide the payment. Any bid made could not be retracted. When these rules were broken, the offending threads would be locked. Depending on the severity of the rule breaking, a warning could possibly be issued, for either the buyer or seller or both. Enough warnings and they could have they privilege to post in the selling area revoked for X amount of time. There were moderators specifically assigned to handle this particular section of the forum. It was more work, sure, but things ran a hella lot smoother.



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ClockKey (#74714)

Heavenly
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Posted on
2015-12-25 18:06:19
Sounds like a confusing and pointless rule to me. You have to edit an Auction to add the current bidder, Or add/remove certain items. Sounds like that site is real strict.



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NegCol (#71390)

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Posted on
2015-12-25 18:17:25
If the auction thread had dedicated mods to ensure that all rules were being followed, then I might be okay with it.

I would prefer a system where you could post your auction, do edits, and then submit it for approval before it was considered "live". Also, if the first comment to the thread was reserved for the auction poster, that would allow them to keep a current high bidders list as well as a FAQ without having to edit the main auction.

I would still prefer the Auction House idea over this one, but it's growing on me.



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GamingGal (#18503)

Sapphic
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Posted on
2015-12-25 18:26:54
Clockkey -- It sounds confusing, but implemented it's not. The site was actually very laid back. Rules like this were in place to keep it that way, though. Pettiness and lying isn't exactly something we want to provide a breeding ground for.

NegCol -- I could see the first comment being used as a place to hold the current bidders and such, and that would help streamline this idea. Our auctions are just so......unorganized that they can barely be considered auctions. They're more attempts by other players to gouge SB/GB. Not saying you are, but a lot of people pull the "end date is X unless I decide to change it!" or get upset that the items sell for less than they wanted when that's not how an auction works at all. This site needs to be willing to put in the hard work (the admins AND the players) to keep things working properly. The Auction House is an amazing idea that I fully 100% support seeing as the old site I was on implemented that idea, but this would be a good temp fix while the coding and manpower is created to enact and moderate it.



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Edited on 26/12/15 @ 01:27:53 by GamingGal [LHL] (#18503)

NegCol (#71390)

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Posted on
2015-12-25 18:47:43
I agree that it can be very disorganized and I've seen some behavior that really should not be encouraged (the double standard of "I can end this auction without a winner at any time but don't withdraw your bids!" is a particular favorite of mine). My only sticking point is that while I don't have the most fancy-pants auctions out there (example of mine), I do try to make them look nice and the preview doesn't show how a post will look exactly (example: it will re-size some images when you post, but not in preview).

I'm going to switch over to "agree" with the caveat that I would prefer to have a free-edit period before the auction post is locked down.



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GamingGal (#18503)

Sapphic
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Posted on
2015-12-26 18:53:35
Added in your caveat seeing as it makes sense.



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Isabella Lena (#49545)

Impeccable
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Posted on
2015-12-26 19:33:57
support



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NegCol (#71390)

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Posted on
2015-12-26 19:35:17
Changed to full support :)



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LEAVING (#66178)

Usual
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Posted on
2015-12-26 19:37:51
No support at all.



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GamingGal (#18503)

Sapphic
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Posted on
2015-12-27 17:14:49
Karim, if you do not support something, please state why. Not giving a reason does not help to further the idea. NegCol voiced their concerned and we worked together to build a better suggestion, and that is something I want to do.



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LEAVING (#66178)

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Posted on
2015-12-27 17:19:52

Look, I'm not the one to scam people. And not being able to edit my auctions, how the fuck am I going to hold an auction, then? .. And that 24h period, are we supposed to make the auction last 24 hours, so we can edit our OWN auction to list the bidders.

No support.




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Edited on 28/12/15 @ 00:20:07 by Karim (#66178)







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