I'm a very active player when I'm not on hiatus so therefore this is my first April. I was really excited and now I'm disappointed greatly. I want the flower decor for my next king and I have NO eggs to myself so far, I've bought nothing. I kept track of my eggs, too (This includes choosing all encounters that give me eggs, not skipping over them.)
Also, it seems after the first day, staff might have upped the encounter rate for egg collection, but it isn't helping at all.
This is how many eggs I got with one full energy bar.
2, 4, 3, 4, 4, 6, 2, 0, 4, 4,.... seems like 3-5 eggs are the most I can get. Which is not enough at all. I'm really salty and probably not going to participate in this event if it keeps up. I went without lioden for months and I can keep doing it. Thats just the way I go. I'm not satisfied anymore with this.

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What Lioden seems to forget, is most of its player base are adults, you know - people that work seven or more hours a day, not including the days we have to commute - that adds two hours to my day. By the time I get home, I have what... 3-6 hours to enjoy the game before I go to sleep?

There are weekends, sure, but I have a horse to look after that takes 6 hours out of my weekend, minimum.

Not to mention, most nights I have to cook, I have to clean up, I have to do... well... I have to do adult things. If the Lioden team think that people older than 16 have free time 24/7 - they're wrong, 16-17 year olds are going to be studying, and most people order than that are working in the real world! No one has time to sit and spend time on this silly sim game when there are bills to pay and mouths to feed - most days I don't even get time to nest/feed/breed my lions, nevermind explore every 2 hours!

Just get rid of donations altogether. Its a waste.

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I don't really see the validity of the argument against personal donations because casual players don't have enough time. You get out of a game what you put into it - in both money and time. I don't think a player should get all the decor they want + access the features they want + not really have to put in effort to get currency tbh

Based on what has happened this event I don't think unlocking the community donation tier is gonna be a problem at all either, so I don't really see a reason to remove that. it's kinda nice to see what the community is doing imo. If there has been a lot of discussion about oh, people aren't donating enough, we won't open the tier, etc, then it's been unfounded. I don't think a gathered bar will solve that problem anyway, looking at other months and how easily people will freak out that the tiers won't open. But I'm on team get rid of activity based tiers anyway so lol

That said, I don't think personal donations will work for most events (unless there's also going to be features similar to egg den added). I'm fine with personal donations during this month, mainly because it has always been a part of it and there is a lore/tradition aspect. I very much believe that personal donations should not increase as the number of members increases however.

-um adding this in here bc idk where else to put it- I have no issue with it being called a donation. I think it's meant to have to do with the features? Like you donate eggs to the egg den and they hatch, so that's why the chicks are there? And then the NCLs are drawn in by the eggs and chicks, and Idk how the spring works. But that's how I thought of it - not really "donating" for the good of the community but like donating lorewise. I see it as the same as a purchase just given a different name I guess. Maybe word choice could be changed? Like eggs given instead of donated, and it could ask you if you want to leave eggs in a certain space to kind of emphasize that the eggs and the rewards are related? Idk.

In my opinion the great thing about lioden events is they're easy to experience even for casual or new players. New players join at all times during the months and they should be able to do decently even if they join the last week. Depending on how the donations work in other events, I think the feature could severely inhibit those new players. For April, I think it's fine - a new player could pretty easily get enough to acquire some nice decor or get some egg yolks, and if they really hate their king they could unlock the spring easily enough in a week - but if not they probably won't be THAT disappointed about missing out, those features are a good benefit but not that cool or interesting tbh (especially when lots of people sell the event marked NCLs and they can be applied anyway). They're more likely to feel like they missed out on claiming Wenet but I feel like most of us are comfortable with the ten day quest system at the moment. And a casual player or a player with a frozen account would have to make the decision between gunning for that 150 to open the spring or not. But in many events I would worry that many couldn't access really fun parts of the events - I think someone mentioned the July raffles? That's a good example. I'm fine with having to choose between basic benefits - exp/age changing or decor? It's already like that during months like August when you can choose to spend currency on studs or purchasing items. But adding more barriers seems unnecessary - you're already having to spend currency on the feature itself, so you shouldn't have to spend currency to access each feature also. Kind of all over the place, but the point is that paying to access a feature where you have to pay more to use it is pretty lame. So I hope it doesn't turn into that.

Okay lots of words written over like a day in five minute periods lol, sorry if it doesn't make a ton of sense

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Well, players already don't get all the items they want, regardless of currency donations to access/open shops. Most events are gathering/fighting based, and as someone pointed out, there's no issue when it comes to event features that require things like amusement items (Cloud Forest, Boneyard, etc). If the personal donation bar was something like Lucky Feet or rabbit carcasses, I doubt this would be as big of a deal as it is.

Players freaking out about tiers not opening is also reason as to why people are suggesting opening the tiers on certain dates. Not only would it reduce player stress, but stress on staff for increasing or decreasing numbers since they already want us to open tiers around certain times anyways.

As much as I like Lioden lore myself, I don't see it as a major concern to keep the system of donating currency. Lore can also be easily changed since donating eggs because of x, y, and z can also just be substituted with something else to donate.

But yeah, I agree with your last paragraph. When I saw the the donation range, I felt some concern on how players who join during the event might fair. I started at 0 EE at the beginning of the event, but I'm also a long time player who knows how to play the game. The first few weeks playing Lioden in general can be confusing, so adding in more frustrating elements to the game could cause those new players to leave.

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"I don't really see the validity of the argument against personal donations because casual players don't have enough time. You get out of a game what you put into it - in both money and time. I don't think a player should get all the decor they want + access the features they want + not really have to put in effort to get currency tbh"

That's a pretty serious strawman and I don't think exaggerating like that helps the conversation. No one is arguing that 'casual players' should get all the decor they want, plus all the features without putting any effort in.

People ARE arguing that Lioden is already a time-consuming game to get anything of worth out of it and making it harder and more time consuming isn't exactly great for the community, especially for casual players. It has already been stated, by Katze, that the administrators plan to extrapolate this 'donation' system to other months.

That's extremely worrisome.

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"You get out of a game what you put into it - in both money and time"
I only want to add that this was true even before that "personal donation" change - for example if player A logged every 2 hours to explore he has more currency than player B who explored once a day. As a result player A was rewarded in more items from shop which he could sell and player B only managed to buy what he wanted for his personal use or even has to buy some items from player A. Player C who regularly buys GB don't have to worry about event currency at all - he will buy what he want from other players. IMHO this is quite fair system, which work very well here on Lioden.

I'm not a firm opponent of personal dotations, but amount of eggs required is in my opinion a little too high, even if it is exactly what you get from Wenets quests.

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Here's an issue with this and skewed numbers for donation tiers. It's fine and dandy to make a player work for what they want -- fine, I'm not against that.

But in perspective: I've adored this game enough to put money into it across the board, and lately it seems things are adding up that are rather against the success of players. Casual players especially.

If you can't discuss gameplay altering features face to face with your member base yeah, you're going to drive peope away, and yeah, there's going to be a lot of debate. It isn't that hard to get involved here and talk to people, staff.

That aside I'm somebody who works shit hours. I only roll on days I don't work while simultaneously dealing with errands and a busy household. As a casual player so far I've hit about 25 eggs every time I roll. That's 150-200 ee total for this event.

Not because I'm lazy -- because I'm an adult with a life who logs onto ld to relax and splurge a bit, which obviously is not much of a supported way of gameplay these days.

Yes this game takes dedication already, that's chill. But stop docking players' hard work. As it is you fiddle with tier numbers. Is it that difficult to estimate your scale of acitivy increase and raise bars at the start?

The whole point of the way tiers are set up is that we unlock them or we don't. Either accept that, or change it. Or look at your previous activity and adjust ahead of time. It's easier to say 'sorry we overshot' and lower numbers than hide behind neutral accounts and watch everyone get offended while you change goals halfway through an event. Of course they're going to.

I'm all for tier unlocking being adjusted or changed to set dates at this point because the whole 'you unlock it or you don't' ideal seems to have fallen down the rabbit hole. And personal donations really should be removed or at least adjusted before you consider placing them into future events. They aren't an awful concept, but right now theu ARE a concerning one considering all of the other issues that people have had complaints over for a lot longer than this. Hmm patterns?

For April alone you already adjust bars, already nerfed egg drops, already changed egg yolks, and now we need personal donations? Yes it unlocked the tier this fast, but isn't that the pattern that drives you guys to increase numbers? Us working too fast? Punishing speedy success? Seems like and expensive cycle to me. Especially if you up numbers, people donate, but the global donation doesn't unlock. Again, the event systsm as a whole needs some overhauling.

Yes, I'm salty. No, I'm not sorry about it. Learn to work with your member base. You're basically dragging your own game through the dirt.

Heda has my full support.

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@cin☆vo, the problem is that even though the donation tiers opened up really fast, that doesn't mean everyone has access to them. They're practically closed for half the players on LD. And since they opened up so fast, the amount of donations needed will go up and up and up until no one can open even the first tier for themself. This is just unfair-- are we supposed to deal with this for all of the events instead of just one? Even if the current system made the tiers unlock really fast, they're still not unlocked. It's not even 'donating' anymore; it's buying access. Not everyone can afford it.

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^ this. The meed for increase to combat personal donation rates. You're going to hit a point where we can't reach the collective bar on top of personal donations. Because you KNOW they won't sit here and allow us to unlock all three event tiers in the first couple days.

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I didn't understand the donating system because I thought I needed to send eggs to be able to buy stuff at the bunny shop and put in 37 eggs just to play with chickens lol there goes 2 GB worth of egg yolk :')

I don't get the point of it. Support to have it removed.

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.... I know i haven't been back for awhile, in fact it's been a year or so.... but i remember quite a few things.... for starters i remember how certain events that required people to give something so the community could unlock it... some players would straight hoard their currency and let other players unlock the bar. This is a bit more fair.
I really like this feature that people still have to donate to get to the tiers and I'd like to point out that the egg den features aren't exactly completely necessary, and secondly... it's only 6th guys. Still 27 days left, plenty of time to get eggs, if you don't want to donate, pick and choose simple as that.
that's kinda the way the events are anyway, you may end up picking some items over others if you have to, or event encounters. I honestly don't see what's wrong with this feature and I've read all the comments so sorry,
No support.

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Forcing the entire userbase to do something no one likes at the cost of event features is not the answer to the currency hoarding problem. THAT is what's wrong with it. It's backwards.

It's almost like staff can't admit they made a hug mistake imlpementing a donation thing in the first place, with CURRENCY of all things. And it's made even shittier by the fact that they just rolled it out without polling or discussing or anything. They just dropped this in our laps with no warning.

THAT is why people are pissed. If no one likes donating, then get rid of donating. It's super simple and yet time and again staff always seems to come up with the most inane "solutions" to problems when users have suggested better things.

What would you rather have? Date-unlocked bars where you get to keep everything you earn and then can spend them when the tiers open or having to donate first and then whatevers left over is what you have and its not as much as you COULD'VE had (and this is including eggs breaking. They have TWO egg sinks now, because one wasn't irritating enough I guess) so now your game of "pick and choose" has even more limited options?

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I still prefer the donation tiers honestly, I am mildly annoyed myself as well I suppose but it's really not that bad. I've always kinda like the donation thing to begin with, communal effort type thing, this is an extension to that.
I guess the most I'd be able to say is maybe past a certain day in the month... like the 20th or something it'd unlock for players regardless so that players could just decide if they want it earlier or something but that ain't the case right now so back to the main point
It's really not a huge deal, I like the feature, it's still early in the month.

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Most people don't enjoy the communal effort. They just do it 'cause they have too if they want the items in the tiers and many of us DEPEND on those items to subsist in this game. There is no sense of coming together in it, no sense of accomplishment. It's more like that feeling when you go to work, stand on your feet for 8 hours, and then your shift is over. It's like FINALLY I GET TO GO HOME. Or at least that's what it's like for me and I'm sure other users.

The only communal effort and sense of accomplishment I have personally witnessed it users coming together to protest a staff decision OR entreat them to maybe not have the tier goals to where we can't reach them just because THEY overestimated user output or didn't want us opening tier 1 in 3 days.

There's always SOME issue with tier numbers which requires fiddling on their part and makes many users annoyed and resentful. CLEARLY Staff has no clue how to accurate gauge user output and then plan accordingly, because this happens almost every event. Dated unlocks removes the headache for both staff and users.

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Trust me I remember several occasions when they adjusted the numbers X)
But that's a bit different for this. If they chose date timed releases that's fine ig but i just... I said no support because I really don't mind this feature, I think it's ok for now, that's my opinion, maybe I'll change my mind on a later event but for now I just don't see the big deal. I understand the agitation and frustration and such but as of right now... I don't see a huge problem with this, so... yeah all there is to it.

Although bit of a side note.... "only sense of communal effort and accomplishment I have personally witnessed" protesting the staff, etc.... what?
Maybe when the numbers were changed sure a bit of disappointment but i also remember party times in chats because the next tier was unlocked by their hard work too.
Did it cause they had to? Sure, but it's still pretty exciting last I knew, especially with new things coming out so often.

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