Agreed! Staff is pushing their players away with faults such as this. They've ignored me and several other people on a vague news post, until we PRIED clarification out of then (and even then, still vague)

Staff, please, PLEASE, listen and interact with your community. (Not only talking about this topic, either)

You have liked this post!

@kam exactly lioden has really gone down hill about this and many issues so far i still loved it but i am so torn about even taking a few months break tried and could not do it at all...

You have liked this post!

I know... I'm kind of thinking that it's too hard to mange two websites, lowkey?? I feel like Lioden is getting neglected in multiple ways, this is a prime example.

You have liked this post!

@kam i think they should have hired another team to take care of wolfden due i played lioden more but thats just me and my honest harsh opnion and i hated being and feeling this way due i am not trying to attacked ur mods at all atm but its hard when their more focused on the wolf one when this was the ogirinal...

You have liked this post!

Lioden's been always neglected in ways. Admins got scared of people bashing their volunteers and instead of addressing things publicly they swept it under a rug, hid all mods, cut off the entire staff interaction from the community destroying the very thing the older mods worked for - the credibility of staff as a whole. And they kept them as volunteers and not properly paid and trained staff. Hell, I've played FR for a long time, they pay their staff, and in all the time I played it (which is 10 years) there was no such problem as under staffing/lack of mods. The only job offer I saw they had was for an art artist because one had to step down due to health problems. Their mods are paid for their time and trained.

This game is a business, and when it comes to games - you HAVE TO interact with your community more than just occasional set update if you want to thrive and build a healthy and good userbase. Take the big shot game companies in the light of Baldur's Gate 3 - Larian was developing it for 6 years, 3 of which were early access, they took all user suggestions into account, made panels from hell, interacted with community and their game became the biggest success of the genre in DECADES.

Lioden had this kind of thing going too. Mods having fun with users, talking, making friends AND also being able to do their job + bring issues to admins as they happened. Sure, some people tried to be too chummy with mods, but it was on users, not mods. Especially that I can attest that the moderators were doing their job at informing/warning/banning users depending on what they did without bias. Alas, here we are now, at a time when my reports take roots in modbox by sitting for literal hours, last time when I was harassed by some users over my pricing of something it took them over 7 hours to get to the ticket. Lioden has some serious problems and this thread is just the tip of the iceberg.

We need them to be more transparent, especially in cases like this, since they just allowed something that breaks their own CoC to continue, which opens a way to pretty much dispute and break the entirety of the CoC to anyone with half a brain. Public statement explaining if they see paperclip as veiled begging or not is the least they can do, especially after all this time.

You have liked this post!

@khal i agreed due its really against their coding and rules but their just letting it go not great considering what they used to stand for every other rules has serious conditions and getting fully banned except this one not really fair to the rest of us we enjoy the game and we loved it we do not want to leave or abandoned them but at this rate they kinda abandoned us the community first which is horrible to be pointed out seriously ur ticket took 7 hours sheesh was it not important enought o be dealt with first wft...

You have liked this post!

I honestly think they are way understaffed for my ticket to have taken so long. When i was a moderator here I was one of TWO for European time zone, the rest were American, two that were in the Australian time zone. Usually at the time of rollover it was me and one of the Australian time zone mods. When I quit many followed, which left the EU times pretty much with no one to take care of anything.
I've spent days cleaning up the forums, putting threads to their respective sub forums and so on, spent YEARS taking tickets as they came and working on them, helping with issues AND keeping an eye on chat on top of that. All for free and a simple thank you.

Right now they clearly lack people that would do any of it, putting way more stress on the admins and with that making them irritable/over stressed and unable to deal with one game, not to mention TWO. There need to be many changes, starting with hiring proper moderation teams for both games. Not getting volunteers. Actually HIRING people, training them properly for at least a full week before putting them into the game AND, if possible, pairing them with experienced mods to have an overseer who will help with questions.

But we are derailing, we do need a proper statement about the state of paperclips, if they are allowed or veiled begging, should they be moderated/banned and so on. Being kept in the dark like that is terrible PR for the game.

You have liked this post!

@khal yes they be actually paying you for ur work no matter who the mods especially if ur all doing the worked for them which is sounds horrible too and lioden is getting bad pr lots of people are leaving actual proable alot of people we know over less people known which is still terrible thing...

You have liked this post!

Alright y'all.

I've had a good long time to sit on this thread, and haven't posted in a while. But I'd also like to bring this back to the attention of the mods.

Previously, I did say I was hesitant to support the idea of mods banning paperclip trades, because it'd be a difficult issue to moderate, and where do we draw the line? When is it begging and when is it just a trade?

Now, as more problems keep popping up with moderation, with Lioden's player base growing exponentially while the number of mods hasn't, and over a year of almost total silence on this issue I've changed my mind.

Paperclip trades CAN be moderated. They have been on other, similar sites to Lioden (in the simulator/virtual pet genre), such as Neopets. They allowed paperclip trades WITH LIMITATIONS.

And they should be moderated on Lioden. At the very least, banned in TC and moved to forum games. It's more than an annoyance or eyesore at this point, it's legitimately affected the gameplay, in my opinion.

Something needs to be said, on an actual post, from the team. Either do something or don't.

You have liked this post!

While I understand that spam is an issue I dont think it should be banned per se as much as it should just have a forum for it. I have a friend who has set up trades like this just for giggles where the most rediculous offer is the winner and the things that were offered were pretty funny. I even won on one of those trades after I gave a cub a pretty nasty name and bio. And like the things that they were offered were the items: “nothing”, “stick”, and my potato cub named “A Crusty Sock” (we still laugh and joke and call her crusty) and its just plain fun for the most part. If it is spam you are worried about then I would think there should be a forum to separate it, yes, but not to ban it. Its just for laughs and giggles for the most part from the people I have seen who have done it, didnt do it for reasons of begging as much as they just found it funny. And thats the point of the game is to have fun.

You have liked this post!

Yeah, I literally just wanted paperclip trades to be separate from the TC because they clog up the TC with trades I'm not interested in viewing. Plus they're literally a veiled form of begging? I'm not even going to sugarcoat it.

Apparently these trades can't be moderated, which I do get to an extent. But I just wish the staff would have implemented a new tab in the TC for paperclip trades, or a subforum.

Guess I'll be blocking and/or soft blocking most of the community at this point. I don't want paperclip trades to show up in the TC at all for me because they push down trades I'm actually interested in viewing. I'm not the type to give away stuff I worked hard on getting for free.

You have liked this post!

Old post but I'm still a believer in the sentiment that it can easily be moderated under CoC 1.22 "Do not use game features for anything other than what they are intended for." as games, roleplay and jokes arent the purpose of TC. Any trade self identifying as such can by that logic be removed. I'm not asking for any major punishment just a tidying up of the features and rulling.

You have liked this post!

Tbh they are easy to moderate, just like any other kind of trade that should not be in TC - we can report them. It's not like mods will have to camp the trading center or anything.
Just give them a subforum in forum games and let us report the trades for being in the wrong place. We all check TC and reporting takes like, what, less than a minute?

And yeah, just like Casey said - it is a form of veiled begging. It basically allows people to go and beg and break not only the CoC 1.22 but also 1.1 letter a, which is basically saying that begging is one of the behaviors NOT allowed on the site.

Also, on a completely different note which this kind of reply from news is directly affecting - if your only answer is "block"/"hide" then you are isolating players from each other instead of encouraging them to engage with each other. That's how the community dies. Lioden was one of the BEST sim games due to how tight-knit the community was and practically everyone heard of everyone, even when we were reaching 100k and more people.
And when the community will die so will the game. Lioden didn't grow to nearly half a million registered members because of ads on other sites or anything like that - it grew because people played and decided it's cool enough to tell their friends about it. If they allow this begging to continue - all the older players will leave and what will be left will be people who do not play but beg, and those will leave the moment it stops being profitable to beg because no one will have anything. Ya know, basic "cause and effect" domino.

You have liked this post!

No support LD mods said it wasn't of moderation issue; and a minimum Sb on a trade would defeat the purpose of freebie trades since only 1 sb would be required for the trade

You have liked this post!

I'm not sure how mods think it isn't an issue. It's literally just begging.

You have liked this post!