I would only support this if it were used in place of Solid/Countershaded, and I really don't think that Lilac, Skyward, Sunset, etc., should be move at all. There's no use fucking over more people than we really have to.

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I love it

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The more I read the more I'd like to see iridescent as it's own new sub-group. That way no rarity gets changed, no base colors get changed and no shades get changed. For example: Ice = iridescent black dark countershaded special and Slate = plain black dark countershaded special. iridescent could throw plains but plains couldn't throw iridescents?

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A new color group only moving the unnatural colors such as cinnabar and green (not that it's passable) but give room to add new bases that maybe are a little more unnatural

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I'm voting NO for now... I think it should be left alone. Here is why...

I've been working very hard on some breeding projects. Adding a new color group would disrupt that and have a huge negative impact on it. And I would imagine that it would affect others and their various breeding projects the same way. If there were some other way of doing this so it wouldn't wreck everything, then I might change my vote later, but as it stands, I don't like the idea at all.

I will explain in more specific detail... This may not be the best example, but keep in mind that there are others working on similar projects which may be hindered by the sudden addition of a new genetics group as well. This is only one example, I'm sure there are many others with similar and equally valid concerns. I beg you to consider the points that I am bringing up here.

I'm working on a Sunset breeding project. This involves breeding every red genetics group lioness that I come across or already own (Including Mauve, Rust, Anjeer, Palomino, Prune, Blazing, Fiery, Tawny, etc. ALL of which are an important part of the project!) to various Sunset Kings in the hopes of eventually getting a Sunset based cub. A lot of the bases that I already have are either Maroon or Cinnabar but a good portion contain those other bases as well. So... Since Sunset is currently a red genetics group base, if Cinnabar were moved into Iridescent genetics group, making it completely irrelevant to my project... That means that I would have wasted my time breeding them and would have to chase all of them and start over. The same is still true, even if Sunset were moved to Iridescent group along with Cinnabar, that still means that a lot of the other Red group bases that I have would be rendered useless to the project.

Other examples are my Cherry Blossom and Teardrop breeding projects. Since Teardrop base is in Cream color group, and so is Cherry Blossom, that means that I could breed my Cherry Blossom male to a female Teardrop lioness and possibly produce Teardrop cubs from it. But if Teardrop base were moved into this new genetics group... That would also ruin that entire project for me and negate any progress I have already made. Even if Cherry Blossom were moved to the new group as well, a lot of the lionesses that I have for my Cherry Blossom project are bases like Buttermilk, Ivory, Cameo, Almond, Vanilla, Antler, Buff, Ethereal, Blonde, etc... And I'm sure all of those would not be moved to the new group, which means I would run into the exact same problem as with my other breeding project.

I'm sure we will run into all sorts of problems like that. It doesn't sound like fun to me. It sounds like a stressful nightmare, in all honesty. So while it's a neat idea, I just don't see the usefulness of it. People who want to breed only naturals or only rainbow lions can still do so. That's part of the fun of it, in the challenge itself. It's great for people who want to focus only on one or the other, but personally I like both natural and unnatural lions. If you want to focus on exclusively one or the other, that's fine- That is why we have marking removers and base changers, so if you don't breed exactly what you wanted, there are ways of changing it. But this would make it impossible for some breeders to achieve desired results and I don't currently see any way of getting around that obstacle. Just remember, not everyone is interested in breeding exclusively one or the other.

If this happens, I would have to chase or sell half or more of my lionesses because they would be rendered useless to my projects. That's heartbreaking. And probably devastating enough to cause many players to want to quit the game out of sheer frustration. It will basically be a disaster and wreck the entire genetics system as we know it. I currently don't even see a different way of implementing it or changing it that will negate this problem. I'm not saying that I won't change my mind later, but this is what I have to say about it for the time being. I hope you can see why this is so distressing for serious breeders who are working on projects. As one of those breeders, I am completely against it. And I don't think it is fair to change the rules of a game right in the middle of it. It will break the game.

Thanks for considering all of our input.

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Although I would love to have Iridescent as a gene group all of its own, it could get complicated because... how do you define what is iridescent and what isn't? I've seen a lot of people bringing up Skyward, Lilac, Celestial, etc, as the special specials. To me, Lilac is the opposite of iridescent because it's a solid purplish brown. Celestial and Skyward also aren't so much iridescent as speckled and countershaded.

We could go deeper, and have Iridescents just marked as something like "Red Iridescent Counter/Solid Dark/Medium/Light Common/Special" so nothing has to be moved. I don't like the idea of having a third rarity outside of distinguishing between super specials (Celestial, Lilac, Sepia and so forth) and other specials (Cocoa, Maltese, Onyx).

I think the best would be to have Countershaded, Solid, and Iridescent. I'm not going to get into maths because it's 11 at night and I'm not about that. However, I don't think SolidxSolid should produce Iridescents (meaning, imo, Ebony, Teardrop, Xanthic, Topaz, Green, Bloodbourne and Cinnabar should move to Iridescent). Iridescents should come from CountershadedxCountershaded, CountershadedxSolid, and obviously from Iridescent parents, too. Some Countershaded bases could be moved to Iridescent as well (again, only my own opinion, but I'd move Arctic, Glacial, Nacre, Cherry Blossom, Citrine, Demonic, Blazing and Fiery).

idk tho. I'm 100% for more fancy free bases because we're waaaaaaay past "realistic" in terms of colours now. I just want people to stop using that as an excuse for no supporting lots of base suggestions

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Personally I'd be really annoyed if any of the five black/solid/specials were made black/iridescent/specials instead, but feel free to pull from the over abundant counter-shaded group.

(In my humble opinion Cairngorn is NOT a solid. It can only be reproduced by breeding to counter shaded, therefor it is a counter shaded in disguise.)

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I'd be fine with this if it were a gradient category.
Then fail colors would be the same. Ex. a cinnabar fails to a cedar by way of being red - light - solid - common instead of red - light - iri - common. This way, all existing pairs should still produce what their owners had in mind for them as long as one member of the pair is the base that became iri. That's pretty fair. As mentioned, most of the bases that would move to iri are already heritable specials, so most people breeding for them either have one or are using a stud with the color.
I wouldn't want it as an alternative shade. They're all over the place in terms of shade! This would slap old projects in the face. Your cream light countershaded armada now is no more likely to produce a cherry than any assortment of cream countershaded lions. You could've been mass gathering mongoose and savnanah base lionesses for free in explore instead of buying custom commons.
I also would not want it as a separate color group for reasons others have already outlined very well. It's bad enough when random albinos pop up. I'd be pretty miffed if a breeding angling for a sunset popped out a glacial. Too close, very painful.

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I forgot to include this, but I would also be ok with Iridescent being added as a gradient or shading category. That's fine, because it would still be useful in many ways, and hopefully shouldn't have such a huge negative impact on everyone's breeding projects. I am 100% against it being added as a whole new color group. I'm all for adding new color groups that start as their own new thing, but I don't think any of the pre-existing bases should be moved anywhere, because that ruins everything for breeders.

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I agree with Kiita and i think this really is a bad idea considering the hard work people go through for their breeding projects. Xylax should consider the arguments regardless of the votes because this is a big step and a step backwards. All the GB, effort and valuable time will go straight down the waste bin for the breeders and it will cause many negative reactions a lot of them leading to leaving LD. That would be a major bump in the whole system and no one wants that. As the set examples that Kiita pointed out just for those reasons all of that is planning to be rebooted and there is no point in going back when your halfway there. I do agree to it if it's placed as a shading or gradient category instead. That would give a chance for both the color bombs and the natural looking lions, both will be happy and both will have breeding chances. If this gets a turn around to an other category i will vote positive. But for now my position stays where it is for the time being.

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My position on this is extremely supportive. I'm such a addict to the weird colors that I get just a bit annoyed when potatoes appear in my cinnabar x fiery breedings, etc.

What I think is a new group should be implemented, but since you plan to fill in the slots of the missing bases, instead of giving them a boost for "reds" or "blues" to implement combination bases for colorful pairings. I know people like cinnabar x fiery or glacial x celestial etc, so maybe for the most supported combinations you could implement rare combination bases for each category, so essentially 4 or so new bases, to bridge the gap? Because ultimately, people who breed to the other four categories now pretty much are ready for the potatoes, so the "breeder beware" comes at their own risk.

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The other thing to consider, for people worried about specials now, is that it leaves room for more natural applicable bases that currently have no room to be added in game

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We already have plenty (tons and tons even) of natural bases already in game. As it stands, there are only a handful of colorful ones anyway. And even if that were a benefit of it, that still does not outweigh the risks of rendering most breeding projects completely useless.

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Well, it wouldn't be the first time a change like this has been implemented. Once upon a time I cpuld have bred any two lions and gotten a cinnabar, but that was changed. Ultimately I don't think it woulr upset the breeding projects as heavily as you purport that it would. And it wouldn't have wasted your time breeding those lions to date because for the duration prior to change that you bred them you still had a percentage chance for them to give you what you wanted, like the cinnabars you talked about. They just didn't. That was ultimately what wasted your time, not an impending change but bad luck. The new group wouldn't change that difficulty, only the colors involved, and since your project to date has failed, it'd make little difference if you had to use a vibrant orange lion instead of a pink one. The only hastle to breeders of bases is that it means they have to cultivate new lions, which has been done before. Marking breeders might have it different, and yes some people will be disrupted, but I don't think it will be irreparable damage like you're thinking it will. A new base category opens the way for many new bases to be added instead of just a couple, broadening the range and possibilities of lioden going forward, and I don't think xylax will move bases around on a whim either. I'm fairly confident long-standing bases like fiery, celestial, skyward, and lilac won't be moved since they still fit in their category. But I think some bases just don't fit in at all and need room to have complementing bases.

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@ZombiePenguin; I think what Kiita is worried (should iridescent be made into a color base group) about is suddenly all those expensive lionesses that she bought/bred would no longer be useful in her breeding project - she'd have to try to sell them all and buy more apropruate lionesses to continue the breeding project. This would be very expensive and very time consuming, it would set many projects back at least a couple of months. At least if the iridescent was made to be a shade, rarity or sub group it would only slightly hinder breeding projects (it would be a nuisance for sure but it could be overcome in only a few generations).

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