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Posted by | [++] The Ability System |
Axel (#6627) Pervert View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-04-08 20:54:29 |
The Ability System- balance for gameplayAfter many changes in the gameplay, the way the battles and the new claiming system works, I think there could be a small addition, which shows our hard work and affects our progress a lot more than stats. So, I propose a new system. The Ability System Description: This system would be completely independent of stats. So, the lions could use abilities in either fighting, charming, or exploring to make them more successful. These abilities would depend on points, level, skill, and karma. How it works in short: There would be a total of 10 abilities in fighting, 3 for charming, and 5 for exploring. (these can be changed) Each ability appears at the aforementioned situations which then can be used to gain advantage. Each ability will need points to have a potential efficiency, skill to reach the true efficiency, and karma, which determines your ability arsenal. Points: Points can be used to make an ability better and be performed with a greater success rate. It is never 100% though. In total 10 points can be added to one ability to reach its max potential, which would be performed at 90-95% efficiency. Points can be earned by: - Leveling (2 points - maybe rarely 3 points) - 31 levels give 62 points - Visiting for 12 consecutive days (1 point) max 16 points - Fighting NPCs (a 10% chance for 1 point) - Claiming lionesses (a 5% chance for 1 point) - Reaching the next karma level (1 point) -only once each karma level - max 34 points - Filling Dreamboat Impression bar (1 point?) Max 180 points can be assigned entirely. Level: Level is mainly used to earn points. Each time you level, you earn 2-3 points, so leveling will become a greater desire to players. It also –just like now- raises the limit of skill you can earn. Skill: Skill would determine how much % of the points you have will be counted in per ability. After all, the points only determine the potential efficiency of an ability. So if you have 10 points in one ability, but have barely any skill, then a low % of these points will be counted into the performed ability, so it still can fail, despite the high success rate. This would also depend on your level, considering the limit on the skill. Eg.: Level 20 lion has 10 points in one ability, so has technically 90-95% chance to succeed, but has only 120 skill (so half of the max of that level), he would end up with 45-50% success at an ability if performed. Level 2 lion has 10 points in one ability, so has technically 90-95% chance to succeed, but has only 12 skill (so half of the max of that level), he would end up with 45-50% success at an ability if performed. (Although, the last would be impossible, due to the point distribution, but it shows well, that low level, even new players will not be at great disadvantage) Karma: Karma would ultimately determine what kind of fighting abilities your lion can have. They could be put into two groups: Good Karma abilities, Bad Karma abilities. (Each would contain 5 abilities) Obviously, if you have positive karma, then you will end up with the former. If you have neutral Karma… then you can have both groups, so it pays off the effort to keep a neutral Karma, and Cleansing Ichor would be used more frequently. However! Pay attention! ‘More’ doesn’t always mean ‘better’. How would this work? Every lion starts out with a set of 10 fighting abilities, 3 charming abilities, and 5 exploring abilities, due to having neutral Karma. All abilities would have no points within them. Upon starting the game with a lion (be it starter or heir) you get 5 points to start out with, which you can distribute wisely among the 18 abilities. From there, the game starts. Leveling, fighting, maybe even attacking other lions could give you points, which you can wisely put into your chosen abilities. You can either work for a positive, negative, or neutral Karma, which will modify the arsenal of abilities in fighting. NPC fights: Once entering battle, you can choose between the specific amount of abilities in an attack depending on your karma. There would be HP for both you and your opponent, just like right now. The success of the battle may depend on your abilities. PVP fights: The bonus abilities (see below) that you can gain from the ability system affect PVP. This would be one thing that could be connected to the ability system and a goal to set for players to unlock the special passive abilities for their lions in each generation. Claiming Lionesses: Once you click ‘Claim her’, you will be brought onto the claiming page. There, your Charming abilities are listed, which you can use to either boost your chances or reduce the temper of the lioness. Maybe there could be a passive ability, which lets you start with an extra heart or two in the bar. Exploring: Instead of just the explore button, there would be abilities listed right along with it, which you can choose to perform every 4 hours (or once a day). They will help you with exploring upon activation. Eg.: One ability could help you find quest items, another that lets you find more resting places, perhaps another that increases or decreases enemy encounters. What about Lionesses? I had two ideas for this. a) They get no abilities or points. b) They would have their own set of abilities. Hunting abilities. They can have a chance of gaining points after each successful hunt, and get 2-3 points after each level-up. These would be passive abilities, so always active. List of Abilities Note: This can be changed, altered, these are just suggestions, taken from this thread or thought out on my own or they already exist. All damage of an ability falls back on your lion if it failed. Fighting Abilities: (The more points you put into an ability, the less chance there is to miss -but cannot overwrite the written-down limit- OR the more damage/protection the ability gives) Negative Karma- - Suffocate - 30% damage - Scratch limbs - 20% damage - Roar of Fury - Gives + 10% damage to next attack - Opponent freezes/ Fail ends in you receiving 10% damage (+ damage done by opponent?) - Neck bite - 20% damage, has a 30% chance of breaking opponent’s neck, so ending the fight - Last Stand - When your lion reaches 20% or less health, he can attack out of turn once. Does 40% damage at 40% chance of success. Positive Karma- - Intimidating Roar - 10% damage - Opponent freezes - Dominating - 20% damage - 30% chance of Opponent getting intimidated and flees - Thick Skin - Receive 10% less damage at next turn - Guaranteed (+ Can use another ability?) - Bluff Charge - 20% damage - Last Stand - When your lion reaches 20% or less health, he can sound a thundering roar, which has a 40% chance of sending the opponent fleeing. Charming Abilities: (The more points you add to an ability, the more chance there is that the lioness will like the move) - Apedamek's Blessing - Adds 1-2 hearts to the claiming bar. - Right of the King - Removes 2-3 temper from the bar - Prince Charming - Adds an extra heart to each of your moves in this claiming attempt. Exploring Abilities: (The more points are put into an ability, the more clicks the ability lasts -but not more than what is written down) - Catnip/Flower Bath - adds 20% more chance to find NCLs and feline opponents for the next 30 clicks. - Mark Territory - reduces the NPC encounter by 20%, adds 20% chance to finding carcasses and items. Lasts 30 clicks. - Lazy Cat - Rest 30% more times to gain more energy. Lasts 20 clicks. - Sneaky Raccoon - Find 40% more carcasses for the next 20 clicks. - Focus - Adds 30% chance to finding quest items/NPCs for the snake. Lasts 30 clicks. Hunting Abilities: - For Lionesses - Power - The more points it contains, the more % chance it adds for bigger carcasses despite level/skill - Lone Hunter - The more points it contains, the more % chance it adds for this lioness to bring back +1 smaller carcass from a hunt - etc… If Roles for Lionesses are brought in, there can be abilities specifically for those roles. Important Notes: - Do not ask for stats to affect the abilities. They wouldn’t. - Submales should only gain up to 120 skill in their patrols to prevent huge advantages. - Ability points are not inherited, just like skill, Karma, and level. The perfect way to balance gameplay between oldies and newbies. - Points for Karma levels are only given out once. Eg. If you reached Dreamboat of Ladies and got the points, then you use the ichor to reset your Karma, you will not get points again for the level scale. (in one lion's lifetime) - Upon switching from positive to negative Karma, or vice versa, the points you already put into the opposite ability will not vanish but will be saved to when you get back to that karma. - Enables tactical thinking - Effort of an individual would be shown in three ways instead of one: stats, points, maxed abilities - No GB items that give you points, please... - Suits all playerstyles: PVP players, PVE players get something to do, and breeders for looks can keep breeding for looks. ----------------------------------- New Additional Ideas1.) Bonus Passive Abilities After maxing out the abilities of one section (fighting, exploring, charming), you could maybe get a bonus passive ability as a reward for that section. These abilities would be of course more valuable, since they are rewards, and would be always affecting your gameplay. Suggestions: Fighting ability - Negative Karma: Beast - Deliver 5% more damage per attack Positive Karma: Paladin - Receive 5% less damage per attack Charming ability - Dreamboat: Start claiming by the bar already having 25% filling Explore ability - Voyager: Receive 10% more exp OR receive additional explore steps I also had the idea, that perhaps after collecting each of these bonus abilities, you could have one reward ability for it, called 'The King of the Jungle'. I am not sure what it would do though. Unlocking this ability will be practically impossible, so it could do pretty badass things. ---------------------------------- This idea is highly in development, and am free to suggestions. Give your own opinion. Thanks. |
Bamon (#12532)
Nice Guy View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-05-04 23:09:53 |
No support from me. Not only is it confusing but it'll completely change the game. I, and others, joined Lioden for what it is now. I didn't join for the kind of game that it'll become if this is implemented. It also sounds like it is based a lot of games such as Pokemon etc with the abilities. I love Lioden because it is different and I wish for it to stay that way. 0 players like this post! Like? |
Doed (#32367)
View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-05-08 17:40:23 |
Quote Axel:
It is not about unbalancing, but about giving the people the freedom of choosing. To choose the way they want. To choose right or to choose wrong. Yes, they might end up maxing out an ability at level 5, but they will have a single maxed out ability... and a bunch of disadvantages when they notice that other abilities arent active. So first you don't want the idea because it will cause a unbalanced lion. Now you don't want the idea so that people can create unbalanced lions, and that is doesn't matter? Make up your mind, because now your just in contradict with yourself. I really like your ability system, but I don't know what you want. Are you some wall that doesn't want to accept other ideas? Fine with me, but I don't like it when people first say this, and the other post they say something completely different. And to be honest, if you block it with the level idea I had. You can max things out, you can choose not to use some abilities. the only thing. You can't kill people in one hit if you choose to upgrade an ability to max. Because then you can put levels together, because they have to choose the right things. If I can put 8 points at one ability and another one is choosing them carefully. That's what I call unbalanced. But yeah, I don't know what you want, because you don't say what's the real problem. 0 players like this post! Like? |
Bracken (#3259)
Amiable View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-05-08 18:32:40 |
Hmm I don't know about this :/ I'll think about it. I really think that if they want to add uses for stats they should do a stat reset. (Of course people will flip out, but, don’t we players flip out at every big update?) Also, I kind of agree on the cubs not inheriting stats, maybe... I think right now I'm just going to go along with whatever they add. They seem to be trying really hard, so I'm sure something will work out. 0 players like this post! Like? |
Axel (#6627)
Pervert View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-05-08 19:20:59 |
@Puzzlette: The first quote was the reply to your block idea, the second quote was for your comment about me wanting free point setting. That is the difference. But yes. People already dont like the restrictions, now add more with blocking their decision on where they want to spend how many points. Giving freedom would at least give the ability for the players to choose their own tactics and choose which abilities they wish to max or even invest points in. They might mess up at one point, but they will learn from it. And there can be an SB item which resets the points in one ability. Because people can have different goals with their gameplay. And if I want to invest points in just... say... 5 abilities, I cannot raise their effectiveness sooner to max because I am blocked by my level. This is why I said in the first post: 'More is not always better', because if you choose to invest points into fewer abilities, you can max them out properly even with casual gameplay. The developers would need to consider how many points they would allow to set per level, and also would need to keep in mind that the max level in general that people reach is not 31, but 26-28. Casual players reach in average level 23-24 before their lion dies. Plus the fact that one can get points without needing to level their lions. They would have useless points lying around. But as I said, I find the additional idea something to consider, but it will be up to the developers to decide if they want to add it or not. Perhaps make use of level in a different way as well? Additional abilities activating at specific levels that one can max? So people would not complain about a 'cap' and would have more choices for their own gameplay. 0 players like this post! Like? |
Dipper (#28104)
Brave View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-05-11 21:24:12 |
This is a great idea! Stats would be kept to look at and show off, and there would still be a stats leaderboard, but this is something that should be implemented. It's a bit complicated, though. 0 players like this post! Like? |
Felicat (#24395)
King of the Jungle View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-05-12 16:08:52 |
As a PvE player who buys all her territory with SB, I'm all for this. It would make my game-play a LOT more interesting. At this point in my game, my stats for PvP against others are completely useless; I lose every fight I have. And guess what? As long as stats can just keep going up, that's never going to change; unless I want to buy or breed to VERY expensive lions with high stats that do NOTHING but enhance PvP, I'll never get anywhere. But that's OK. I'll save up SB and buy more space as needed. It's kinda funny how people are accusing Axel of trying to force their play style on others, when they're doing the very same thing by making it so that new players HAVE to buy/stud expensive, high-stat lions to accomplish anything, which is likely what would happen if stats are implemented as they currently are. Since I flat out refuse to spend GB on a player bred lion, for stud or otherwise, I won't be having a 1K+stat lion unless I do it myself. Currently Lioden only really rewards two play styles: PvP stat monsters, and super breeding pretty cats. I don't want to do either of those, I want to play the game: hunt my food, raise my cubs, claim new beauties, and maybe give away or sell some when space gets low. This play style feels largely ignored. All the NCLs are the same. All the Explore battles are the same. Even hunting never fails. I would LOVE a system that changes this up, makes it challenging to be king. I wish I could add some new ideas, but I'm just not talented at working out systems. I notice a lot of "This is too complicated." How so? You earn points, buy/enhance abilities, and then use them. Anyone who's ever played any current gen video game can handle this with ease. Hell, Shining Force was more complicated, and I played that when I was....10? 0 players like this post! Like? |
Mimi (#24711)
Usual View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-05-15 02:59:54 |
I'd totally like that the fight we fight with other lions would goes just like the challenges: I am somewhat good stated, but many can win a challenge against me... it would be nice that a higher stat only decrease the % of chance to win... but those stats are still hardly won and it would piss me off that my stats doesn't make any differences yet. But I do get your point: my lion is placed near too many high stats in the territory and I'd like that my territory was set among stats near my number of stats so that when I am on territory I only have fair opponents near myself to challenge. but since your point isn't this... and that your point also request too much work for the server... I cannot support, sorry. The admins already have fixed the issues with the TOO easily won stats... thought I do believe the too easily won stats were lowered to low stats lions, for I saw how my low stats lionesses get more stats when eating/playing with something special. I do believe the new stats that comes to the cubs are pretty fair... 0 players like this post! Like? |
Starr* - COF/LAWS/CM/VV (#22773) Ill-Natured View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-05-19 11:35:48 |
I really like this idea axle it adds a lot to whole experience of the game! As of now the stats seem to be rather useless, I inderstand they are doing something with them, but this idea looks awesome! 0 players like this post! Like? |
LastGuardian (#32978)
King of the Jungle View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-05-19 17:07:09 |
I am not in support of this idea, and it's not just because of stats as an entity. First off, this system is highly confusing. I'm time it could be adjusted to, but it will be crippling to new players trying to understand how it works. Second off, unless rolled lions suddenly become the most popular thing on the market there is a 0% chance this will fix new players having to buy new lions to get anywhere, as regardless of what the stats are most rolled lions are just plain plain, and appearance and stat breeders alike have distain for a lack of appearance. As for my support of the stat system, it seems the staff has fairness figured out already. Why not just used tiered brackets whenever they start doing stat events rather than resetting and losing a large portion of players who very likely spent good money for statted lions? I can understand that a new or casual player finds this daunting, but at the same time you have to remember that lioden is FREE because players like me buy GB so we can get ahead. If you remove the advantage of buying GB you remove interest of paying players and effectively de-fund the game, which as far as I'm concerned is bad for everyone. You suggest removing the stat system perhaps; now you not only have the same problem of player loss as before, but now you remove the only unique aspect of Lioden's breeding system, effectively making it a lion based clone of every other breeding game on the market. Yes, stats aren't all that fair, but given time and a little patience everyone can earn enough SB to buy a good lion and stay him/her up. It's not impossible, just hard. GB offers a quick bypass to this hard part. That's what players pay for. So before everyone condemns stat breeding remembers that the real losers of this would be everyone, not just those that breed for stats. 0 players like this post! Like? Edited on 20/05/14 by LastGuardian-(Challenge Me) (#32978) |
Axel (#6627)
Pervert View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-05-19 17:19:56 |
@LastGuardian It isnt at all confusing. Play the game and you get points -> Invest these points to max out abilities -> Use abilities. This is what people need to know. Quite easy, isnt it? And stats would still affect PVP, so it wouldnt be gone. You can expect that stats will be changed or else PVE will not work. We were also told that a completely new system will come in for PVE, so stats will have little or no use to it, or at least not in this form as it is right now. So there will be changes. As for buying good lions... But this is it. Even with a starter lion you should be able to survive and reach your goals in the game. Progress the same way as everyone else with the required gameplay. This system gives a balance in PVE for that. Why would the new players feel forced to buy new high statted lions? They shouldnt need to in order to have fun and have a chance in the game. Why should they need to be dependent on others? This is what this system does. It enables fair gameplay for all in the PVE aspect without forcing new players to buy lions. Instead, they will have the choice if they want to or not. 0 players like this post! Like? |
LastGuardian (#32978)
King of the Jungle View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-05-19 17:47:43 |
@Axel Not everyone is brilliant, and for someone your percentage stacking system would be confusing and mis-prioritized, sucking the fun right out of the game for any young player who mistakenly puts ability points in the wrong place. As for stats, perhaps they will change, but damaging or removing the ability of players to breed for stats or the equivalent would effectively remove a reason for playing the game. As for being able to achieve goals with starter lions , right now stats aren't the only problem with a rolled lion. As I said before, even if you fix the stat issue, which if they are as useless as people say shouldn't be a problem anyway, there is still the problem that without customization, which last I checked cost GB, your lion is still plain at best, ugly if you got unlucky. Which means you cannot breed this lion, or do much of anything but use him as a place holder and explore. Why not fix the implied problem rather than blame stats? Why not make it so main males can gain stats more effectively, rather than destroy stats since new players are stuck now? 0 players like this post! Like? |
Donomah (#16401)
Sweetheart View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-07-03 01:08:07 |
I support this all the way, stats right now are useless especially if you have earned full territory slots and now it's there just to "brag". I really wish this would change and stats would have a greater meaning that... what is is right now. 0 players like this post! Like? |
Another Actual Lion (side) (#16656) Deathlord of the Jungle View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-07-27 17:09:31 |
I like this idea a lot personally. It makes you able to 'customize' your lion even more. 0 players like this post! Like? |
Axel (#6627)
Pervert View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-10-17 20:26:10 |
Keeping this because I believe stats are not the best choice to base PVE on. PVP okay, with these same tactical choices, but not PVE with the stats not changing. 0 players like this post! Like? |
silver (#44920)
Impeccable View Forum Posts Posted on 2014-12-21 12:14:34 |